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 ************
Topic 10        Sun May 14, 1989
M.CARTWRIGHT                 at 00:19 CDT
Sub: HELP! General Q & A

this area for general system Q&A that are too broad to be confined to the more
specific topics

205 message(s) total.
 ************
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 1         Thu Nov 18, 1993
B.PUGLIA                     at 19:48 EST

I will be getting a 1040fm and I am looking for the information that
will me to install blitter IC into the ST1040fm. The holes for the
socket are there. I presume it will take more then just adding the
socket and blitter IC. Does have anyone have or know where information
might exist ? Has anyone made the mod ? Does anyone have the pinout data
for the blitter IC. 
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 2         Thu Nov 18, 1993
R.BODEN [Rick]               at 22:15 EST

Well, I put it the new CPU last night and everything worked perfectly.  While
I was on a roll, I decided to wire in my two SIMMs again.  This time I left in
the old 512k chips and what?...no problems!  Now I have 2.5Megs.  What to do
with all this memory?  I guess it's time to order Geneva.

Rick


 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 3         Fri Nov 19, 1993
A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt]       at 08:44 EST

Rick,

Glad to hear you got the memory working. (Mine is still giving me trouble.
What's that again? What did you say? <g>...)

Yes, Geneva will turn your entire computing experience around. Has a good
manual, too!

Al

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 4         Fri Nov 19, 1993
R.BODEN [Rick]               at 21:58 EST

Al,

Great software and a good manual too?  Well, I'm sold!

Rick
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 5         Sat Nov 20, 1993
A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt]       at 06:09 EST

Rick,

Yeah! A guy I know did the manual....

Al

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 6         Sat Nov 20, 1993
P.THOMPSON19 [PAUL]          at 08:51 EST

I just got a used Mega 2.  Can I just plug in 2 more megs of memory if wanted?
If so, is there much to the job?
                        Paul

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 7         Sat Nov 20, 1993
MUSE [Tomas]                 at 14:09 EST

Paul,
 There is a file in the libs that details the procedure.  It's a bit of work.
It's much easier to install an XtraRAM+8, but then you get into TT RAM
territory.

 ===Tomas===


 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 8         Sat Nov 20, 1993
GENIELAMP.ST [John G]        at 15:19 EST

Tomas,

 Have you heard any news on the STe version of XtraRAM+8?  Brad is in
 London until this Tuesday, so perhaps he'll know something more if
 you haven't heard of anything.

 John


 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 9         Sat Nov 20, 1993
T.MCCOMB [=Tom=]             at 22:34 EST

I would be very interested in an 1040STE version of XtraRam+8 too.

The 1040STE has 4M of RAM now as well as an ADSpeedSTE.


 -Tom McComb
  {10:20 pm

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 10        Sun Nov 21, 1993
MUSE [Tomas]                 at 00:35 EST

John G.,
 I heard from them on the 16th but the STE version wasn't mentioned. I'd like
to get one for the Mega STE I use at work.

 ===Tomas===

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 11        Sun Nov 21, 1993
J.HURLEY1 [Jim Hurley]       at 04:47 EST

The ICD Cat. is closed, and there is no CPU Topic so I'll post here.

I just purchased the AdSpeed ST closeout CPU upgrade which replaces the 8MHz
68000 in the 1040ST with a 16MHz 68000 and cache memory.

The bus constraints in the 1040 require that it still be clocked at 8MHz, but
the cache memory helps speed up program loops and general exceution. QINDEX
shows 200% speedups (and much more impressive with Warp_9).

In operation, there is a very perceptible speedup in general, but not a
doubling. Say, 50%.

The installation is a pain, you have to clip out the soldered-in 68000 (what
is it? a 100-pin chip it seems). But I did the installation in about 2 hours
and everything worked again when I powered up. I have built a great deal of
hardware, so I had all the tools and experience. You will need a good set of
dykes, solder-sucker, and small needle-nose pliers to be most efficient.

I found that it helped fix a problem I was having in a MIDI program, and the
performance improvement is very apparent. I suppose if I had a real fast hard
drive I would see even more improvement.

The closeout price was $99.95, well worth it. Order now before the supply is
gone forever.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 12        Sun Nov 21, 1993
M.EASTER [Mike]              at 06:00 EST

Beware.  4 screenfuls.

It has not been a happy day in the computer room today.

As I was sitting there doing something, I don't even remember what, I thought
I saw a small whisp of smoke arising from my 1987 vintage 1040 STf, over the
left rear third of the CPU section.  Sure enough, in short order, my power
light and floppy drive light started flashing intermittently.  I turned off
the power switch and began to ponder my fate.

I had a "spare" identical model which I thought had a bad floppy drive, since
the floppy light comes on, but the drive doesn't spin up or read anything from
the floppy.  The TOS ROM desktop comes up like it does if there's no disk in
the floppy.  [Does anyone know what problem causes that (floppy doesn't spin
or read)?  It turns out, see below, that it isn't the floppy drive assembly.]

So, I decided that I would remove the floppy drive from the seriously
sick...ie dead, unit I was using and put it into the other one.

But...that caused me great trepidation.  In order to work on the unit that
just went up into a puff of smoke, I was going to have to disconnect it from
the hard drive.  That mean turning off the hard drive, which I really didn't
want to do.  Of the many reasons I leave it on all the time is added the fact
that a few months ago when I turned it off, when turned back on, it had a
stiction problem; which I ultimately solved by lifting the closed attached
unit and quickly turning it one way or another.  I was afraid the next
stiction wouldn't unstick.

But, I proceeded.  Shutting down the switch box for the peripherals, detaching
the computer, opening same, including the shielding over the power supply
which lives where the smoke came from, peering at the slightly heat affected
components nearby and noting that there were no large blobs of molten
components, removing floppy drive assembly, opening new candidate, removing
floppy assembly from her, trading, reassembling new candidate, hookup,
test....floppy drive doesn't work.

Hmm.  Must be something in the computer, not the floppy drive.

Re-disassemble.  Now, I remove the power supply from the dead computer and
replace it with the power supply from the would be new candidate, now rapidly
turning into a cadaver for donor organs.  Interestingly enough, the two power
supplies looked very different from each other and were surprisingly easy to
remove and replace.  Re-test.  Working computer!

Now for the hard drive.  Nope.  No go.  No amount of twisting and turning and
gently bonking and such will make it start up.  I was afraid of that.  Open up
hard drive to see if there is something I can reach in there to turn a little
bit.  Everything seems to be sealed away from my naughty probing.  Any
suggestions?  [Besides the obvious advice to buy some new equipment?]

Hard drive: Supra 20 meg (no fan version) with MiniScribe 8425 with imbedded
controller.  Inside the enclosure there is some kind of troubleshooting light
which isn't visible when it is in the box.  That light blinks out what seems
to be a code: 3 slower blinks followed by I think 4 very rapid blinks, pause,
repeat.

This floppy only world is quieter, but oh so slow.

Mike Easter
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 13        Sun Nov 21, 1993
J.MEEHAN3 [>> Joe M << ]     at 08:30 EST

Message    190, Sat Nov 20, 1993 P.THOMPSON19 [PAUL]

    >  Can I just plug in 2 more megs of memory if wanted?          <

         There are a couple of different Mega2 boards.  Some are
 rather easy (solder in chips and very minor board changes) at least
 one version is more difficult (there are no traces to the locations
 for the chips.  There is a set of instructions in the RoundTable
 Library.


                 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~  more.

 Message    195, Sun Nov 21, 1993 J.HURLEY1 [Jim Hurley]

         Thanks for your comments, I have heard the same from other
 happy owners.

         You might be interested to know that ICD has their own
 RoundTable.  You can see them there if you have any questions.  That
 is why their Cat was closed I believe.

 >> Joe M <<


                 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~  more....

 Message    196, Sun Nov 21, 1993 M.EASTER [Mike]

 Mike,

         Sorry to hear about your problem.   I would guess the light
 you are seeing on the drive is just a access light.  Some drives seem
 to have one and then have an extension to display on the outside.
 Anyway I would guess you still have the same sticky drive problem.

         First the sermon: Thou shalt replace any drive having a
 sticky problem promptly. <grin>

         You might have a little luck if you take a look at the top of
 the drive and if you see the little brass strap looking like a
 battery contact in a calculator, lift it a little.  It should be
 resting on top of a spindle (metal rod).  The rod is connected to a
 disk mostly hidden under the cover.  You need to give the spindle and
 the disk a little spin. You will likely feel the little tight spot
 where it was stoped and will feel it again as you rotate the spindle.
  Be sure it is not on a tight spot and then try turing it on.

         Best of luck, it's a matter of luck from now on as to keeping
 that drive running.  The next time you might not be so lucky, so you
 better back up and get a new drive.  You know you want and NEED an
 bigger and faster drive! <grin>

         BTW if you had a High Res monitor you would see that your
 message was only one screen long. <grin> Maybe you should get a TT at
 the same time as your new drive.

 >> Joe M <<

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 14        Sun Nov 21, 1993
A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt]       at 12:06 EST

Jim,

ICD has its own Roundtable on GEnie, BTW.

Mike,

Ouch! No, no suggestions, except the one that you don't want. :)

Joe,

Heck, in 1600X1200 Mike's message was just a little spot on the screen! :)

Al

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 15        Sun Nov 21, 1993
M.EASTER [Mike]              at 12:55 EST

Joe M. - re light/s, spindle, screenfuls, HD shopping

On the case outside there are two lights; a poweron light and a "busy" light,
which I would call the access light.  Inside, located in a place that doesn't
even cause a glow through the vents of the case, is another light.  When the
stuck drive is turned on, the poweron light lights, the busy light very
briefly semi-flashes and stays off, and the "secret" light begins its little
"code" blips; 3 quick (guessing, on 100 msec, off 100), about 4 _real fast_
(maybe 10-30 msec each on/off, like flicker, difficult to count.  There is a
one or two second pause and the sequence repeats, over and over.  Access light
is separate.

I saw a flat sponge-like cover attached to a brass strap that would satisfy
your description.  I have a feeling I will be able to touch the spindle by
lifting the sponge/strap, but not reach much further.  Two pc boards overlie
the drive, one easily liftable, the other not.  The spindle passes through a
pc board hole.  Hmm.  Maybe I can "saw" the spindle with a rubber edged
spatula.  Will give it a shot after I get off here.  When I turned the hard
drive off, it seemed to stop spinning "instantly" or at least very fast rather
than whining down.  I may have a bigger problem than a little stickiness.

One screenful on a high-rez monitor?  Oh goody!  I can just ramble on and on
without using up too many screenfuls :-)

Mike Easter

Re shopping hard drives.  As opposed to shopping for a drive directly
compatible (DMA) with this old computer, it seems that I should lean in the
direction of a drive that would need some kind of interface from ICD, ie IDE,
SCSI, in order to get competitive prices and better compatibility with future
computer.  Not so?  I look for used stuff from a dealer and haggle.  I like
the idea of removable, but am much influenced by feature /price
considerations.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 16        Sun Nov 21, 1993
BRIAN.H [ST~SysOp]           at 14:18 EST

Jim H.,
  I presume you mean the ICD topic not category. As others had stated there is
a ICD RT:

P 1220   Your host: Tom Harker (ICDINC)


~~Brian..Written on Sunday 21 November 1993 at 02:28 p.m. ADT


 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 17        Sun Nov 21, 1993
MUSE [Tomas]                 at 20:09 EST

Mike,
 Try giving the hard disk a sudden horizontal twist.  BTW, it is likely that
you could have left the hard drive on.  I've seen it done. For the other ST,
perhaps the floppy controller or the Yamaha chip need to be reseated or
replaced?

 ===Tomas===


 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 18        Sun Nov 21, 1993
T.MCCOMB [=Tom=]             at 20:34 EST

  Mike-

Here's some advice, but use it at your own risk.

Background:  I leave my HD's on all the time too.  There are four, a MegaFile
30, and SUpra 30, A ToadFile with 80M Seagate and a Syquest.

Before leaving on a recent trip to Florida, I powered down the system. WHen I
returned and powered up, the Supra and the Seagate would not spin up.  In the
past I was able to get them to eventually spin up by powering them on and off
20, 30, maybe 50 times, rapidly.  FOrget it. This time they were El Stucko
Primo.  I opened them, looking for a spindle to turn. Nada.  So as a _last_,
VERY Last, resort- I gave the mech a good shot on the edge of the desk.  It
spun up when I turned it on. I ran D. Edge on it and all was well.  I gave the
other a good shot.  It would now spin up.  Ran Diamond Edge on it and it too
was fine.  Both have been powered up since August now with ZERO problems.  I
have not turned them off.  Your mileage may VARY.  Again, take this advice AT
YOUR OWN RISK.

 -Tom McComb
  {12:25 pm}  Sunday, November 21, 1993


 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 19        Sun Nov 21, 1993
EXPLORER.1 [] Ron []         at 21:44 EST

Mike,

  It would be worth trying to reseat the power connectors between the hard
drive, host adaptor and power supply. Corrosion on the pins can keep a drive
from spinning up.

  If that doesn't do it, try flipping the hard drive over on its back and
applying power. This may shift the force to a bearing surface previously
unused.

   Good luck!

     -- Ron

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 20        Mon Nov 22, 1993
A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt]       at 03:23 EST

Mike,

A Link would give you full SCSI compatibility, a real plus. A SyQuest as a
main drive is also a fine idea, since your capacity is unlimited. (Some users
use two of them, so backups are as simple as can be.)

A Floptical is ideal for anyone who doesn't yet have the capability of
reading/writing 1.44-meg disks, and as a bonus it handles them from two times
to 10 times faster than a normal floppy drive does.

But I would also urge you to upgrade your TOS. TOS 1.0 is extremely limited
when it comes to handling modern hard drives. I'd go straight to 2.06; no
sense in using any other TOS these days.

Al

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 21        Mon Nov 22, 1993
J.MEEHAN3 [>> Joe M << ]     at 05:04 EST

Message    199, Sun Nov 21, 1993 M.EASTER [Mike]

         I wish you luck.

         I would look for a SCSI drive.  Most host adapters for the
 Atari and most drives are SCSI, including most internal drives.

 >> Joe M <<

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 22        Mon Nov 22, 1993
ICDINC                       at 10:10 EST

Jim, THanks for the post.  Glad it is all working well for you.

        - TOM -
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 23        Mon Nov 22, 1993
M.EASTER [Mike]              at 10:58 EST

Re my hard drive problem -

Thanks, Tomas, Tom, Joe, Ron, Al, and anyone I've missed for your insightful
and personal experience advice.

I haven't gotten it going again with most of the maneuvers suggested,
including "twists" in various positions to try to use the inertia of the drive
itself to unstick.  Bonking hasn't done it yet.  I haven't yet done the "saw"
or twist the spindle yet.  It is awkward to disassemble in situ (connected)
because of the extremely short drive cord.  (Long story about that, don't have
time for it right now, shortened by Supra when it was new and experiencing
warranty covered problems.)

I need to know more about dis/connecting equipment while it is turned on.

I know it's bad to dis or connect a printer while the computer is on.

Is it OK to connect a hard drive to the computer while the computer is off and
the hard drive is on?

Mike Easter
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 24        Mon Nov 22, 1993
SANDY.W [sysop]              at 13:28 EST

Mike - I also have a sticky HD. I'm not going to recommend this, but there is
a large round thing under the circuit board on mine, that I turn with a long
thin blade of some kind (whatever I can find easily). I can feel it give when
I get it turning. Of course I do this with the power off! This has always
worked for me where the twisting and jiggling maneuvers have never worked.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 25        Mon Nov 22, 1993
MUSE [Tomas]                 at 20:49 EST

Mike,
 Power on/disconnecting is never advisable but, like I said, I've seen it done
(at the connection to the DMA port) and you seem to have little to lose.  The
best idea is to take the mech out and find a way to spin the disk.

 ===Tomas===

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 26        Mon Nov 22, 1993
J.ZENTZ1 [wintermane]        at 21:24 EST

 re stuck hd

Long ago a freind told me a nifty way to unsick a drive( warning he was a
twit:)

 If you have a set of speakers(sterio type big) turn on the drive while
playing a heavy bass tune aimed at the drive( dont get the speaker too close!)
this can vibrate the sucker lose but it could break it too.

 As I said he was a twit use with caution!
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 27        Tue Nov 23, 1993
GENIELAMP.ST [John G]        at 00:06 EST

Mike,

 Go easy on the bonking!  No use getting bad data!

 John


 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 28        Tue Nov 23, 1993
M.EASTER [Mike]              at 06:55 EST

Sandy - re large round thing under the circuit board

Your description along with Joe's description of the brass strap over the
metal rod spindle combined together describes mine pretty closely.  My brass
strap's top is covered with a thin layer of foam or rubber non-conductor.  The
brass strap/cover is over a large (~1 cm) round metal thing under a circuit
board.  That circuit board is accessed by lifting another attached circuit
board to get to it.  The second pc board would be muy difficultado to remove
or lift.  It seems to be very integrated in its mounting to the drive mech
itself.  (Parts of a heavy drive frame overlie that pc board.)

My problem, which is beginning to worry me much about future function of this
drive, is that round thing does not want to turn.

I think I may need to do some serious disassembly; past the second pc board.
I hope I don't find that I developed a head crash when I turned it off.  It
sure seemed to stop faster than ever before.

wintermane - re big stereo speakers

I think I'll pass on that one.  It would bother me and the cat, too :-)

Mike Easter
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 29        Tue Nov 23, 1993
A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt]       at 08:16 EST

Mike,

I would not connect up the hard drive while it is turned on. Tom Harker may
have the technical reasons for this, but I recall from a long time back that
it's not a bright idea.

Al

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 31        Tue Nov 23, 1993
ICDINC                       at 09:26 EST

IF your drive is a Seagate ST157N or something similar then Sandy W. has the
right idea and that should work "forever" (which is limited to 7 years).

The "round thing" is part of the spindle motor flywheel and if it doesn't
turn, you are in trouble.

      - TOM -
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 32        Tue Nov 23, 1993
M.EASTER [Mike]              at 10:52 EST

Tom - re "round thing", spindle motor flywheel, Seagate ST157N

Although the drive in question is supposed to be a MiniScribe 8425, when a guy
with an e-mail address of ICDINC, tells me "you're in trouble"...

I think I'm in trouble.

Mike Easter
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 33        Tue Nov 23, 1993
JWEAVERJR [John@RSCARDS]     at 11:16 EST

My answer to the stiction problem: unplug the power cable to the drive at the
power supply; then, make momentary contact with it repeatedly (pretend the
disk drive is a light bulb, and you're trying to mimic a strobe light with
it). About 5 seconds of this _should_ get your drive spinning.  -JW
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 34        Tue Nov 23, 1993
SANDY.W [sysop]              at 12:17 EST

Mike -

Regarding connecting a hot drive...you might not have anything to loose with
the drive, but I'ed be concerned about possible problems to the computer. My
understanding is that the damage can go either direction.

You might be in trouble. I know mine takes more force to get it started the
longer it has been off, but it has always turned. The hardest part for me was
reaching the flywheel. On the Seagate, there is not a lot of room between the
circuit board and this part to maneuver in, and I don't like dismantling
things unless I absolutely have to.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 35        Tue Nov 23, 1993
ST.LOU [Lou]                 at 20:16 EST

Pardon my obvious hardware ignorance... but can you put the Seagate 251N into
a Megafile 30. Both items are sitting on my shelf because one has no case and
the other has a case of stiction!
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 36        Wed Nov 24, 1993
M.EASTER [Mike]              at 03:39 EST

Well, I did some "serious" disassembly (removing the second printed circuit
board).  Turns out it wasn't as hard as expected.  After removing the screws
and all the little plugs (those guys were stuck!) I was able to slide the
board out from under the drive frame obstructions.

Once I was able to get to the flywheel proper, I _can_ turn it.  This drive
has some _serious_ stiction.  It is fairly difficult to turn all the way
around, not just one spot or so.  However, if I spin it, it spins freely.
There's no way a drive motor is going to start that disk spinning.

I'm gaining an understanding of how stiction works.  Correct me wherever I'm
wrong.  At rest, the drive heads actually come in contact with the disk.  In a
proper condition, the "smoothness" of the disk and heads results in easy
enough turning.  When the disk is spinning, the liquidity of air results in a
"hydroplaning" effect, and the heads and the disk are not actually in contact,
like a car sliding on a wet street.  At rest, the car's wheels will not slide
on the same street; as if trying to push it with its brakes on.

With time, temperature, atmospheric conditions; the "smoothness" of the disk
and/or heads "goes away".  Then, when the heads and the disk are in contact,
the disk doesn't want to turn; and the tiny little motor can't overcome that
friction plus mass inertia.  That is my drive's current condition.

I have a plan, however, which I will keep a secret for now :-)

And if the kiddies will come back to visit Uncle Wiggly tomorrow, we'll see
what happens.

Mike Easter
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 37        Wed Nov 24, 1993
J.MEEHAN3 [>> Joe M << ]     at 05:15 EST

Mike,

         I really don't know, but I don't think the heads ever tough
 the disk (at least I don't think they are suppose to).  What happens
 according to the information I got from Seagate is they had a problem
 with the lubrication used in their drives at one time.  They lube got
 hard in time and .. well you have felt the results.  I have also
 heard other opinions of the reason for the problem.  In the end you
 are right, the motor does not have enough torque to start it turning.

         Also they don't get better with age.

 >> Joe M <<

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 38        Wed Nov 24, 1993
ICDINC                       at 08:00 EST

Mike, :-)

Try wrapping some string around the flywheel in the direction of rotation to
make a pull starter.

You do have it right.  I have heard the lubrication story like Joe said.  I
have also heard that the heads and media become more polished over time
(lapped together) and because of the increased surface contact area, more
initial force is required. That is the reason that the glass substrate makers
have intentionally put slight ridges less than the head width in the media.

Also heard that spindle bearings slowly lose lubrication over time causing it.
 As you can see, stiction can be a compound problem.  The good news is that it
doesn't seem to be a problem with the modern drives designed and made in the
past year or so.

Lou,

You will still need a SCSI host adapter for that Seagate N drive.  The
Megafile case doesn't include one. We are closing out our FNST kits which
include an AdSCSI Plus host adapter,case, power supply, cables, and software.
...everything except the drive for $159.95 plus S&H.

Call 815-968-2228 if interested.

 - TOM -
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 39        Wed Nov 24, 1993
M.EASTER [Mike]              at 08:33 EST

The good news is that the hard drive is running.

Once I found that I could turn the flywheel housing from its edge, and that I
could spin it with my hand, I decided to create a way to access that edge with
everything put back together.

I found a tiny space between the framework of the drive housing and the
printed circuit boards.  I could turn the flywheel housing with a brass
ballpoint pen insert backend probe reaching through there.  With some precise
calculations as to where I would need an access hole in the inner layer of the
base/external housing to pass the probe through the base/external housing and
through that narrow space, I drilled a small hole in that housing.

Testing showed me I could turn the flywheel housing through that hole.  I
reassembled, turned it on, and with some off/on plus probe pushing it spun up.
I was also able to do that with the drive connected to the computer, since it
only required lifting the topmost external enclosure.

The bad news is that all this screwing around has given me much bad data on
the disk, and it won't autoboot.  In fact, I don't even know where my 4th
partition has gone.  I'll have to do some formatting and mapping and see just
how bad things are.

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 40        Wed Nov 24, 1993
T.MCCOMB [=Tom=]             at 08:56 EST

How about heating it up with a hair dryer?   Just a thought.

 -Tom McComb
  {8:46 am}  Wednesday, November 24, 1993


 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 41        Wed Nov 24, 1993
SANDY.W [sysop]              at 12:28 EST

Interesting idea about the hole. I just never put the case screws back in so I
can slide the top down just far enough to shove the flywheel. Actually, I
usually just leave the drive running unless I'm going to be gone for a few
days.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 42        Wed Nov 24, 1993
M.SWANSON5 [MARK]            at 20:24 EST

      Hello!
      I have a problem and I am hoping someone has an answer for me....I have
two hardware devices - my modem and a MIDI sync box- that use my RS-232 port.
I am getting very tired very fast of having to plug and unplug them all the
time, and I want some kind of splitter, and I saw one with a mechanical switch
on it, but it had two female D-plugs, and I need it to have two male ones. I
am handy with a soldering iron, and could install two male plugs, but is this
the way to go? I have heard of active switch boxes that switch electronically,
with no switch to wear out. This seems better.
      I even saw a kit in a back issue of a european electronics mag that
spoke of a RS-232 splitter, but I don't know much about it. It needed a power
supply, though, so maybe it was a pretty good kit. It did not say if it was
for Atari or IBM, and I would have to pay to get the article, just to read it
and find out. Can any one offer any help?   THANK YOU...
                    Mark Swanson
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 43        Wed Nov 24, 1993
J.HURLEY1 [Jim Hurley]       at 23:54 EST

OK, I have a knack for using the wrong categories - I couldn't find anything
about mouses (mice, meese), so I'll post here.

I have a problem with any mouse device that uses rolling parts. Inevitably the
rollers get coated with gunk, often in a few hours and the rolling action
becomes erratic and annoying. When I can't stand it any longer I open them up
and clean the rollers. I have a Sun Sparcstation at work and it uses an
optical mouse which seems far superior.

I've gone through three Atari mice by various vendors and haven't found
anything I really liked.

Anyone else have these problems and found a satisfying solution?
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 44        Thu Nov 25, 1993
J.MEEHAN3 [>> Joe M << ]     at 08:52 EST

Message     42, Wed Nov 24, 1993 M.SWANSON5 [MARK]

 Mark,

         You could use a genderchanger (it's a real word <grin>) or if
 you look you will find a switch that does what you want.  I have been
 tempted several times to get one.  The other choice is to modify a
 program I have to control X-10 devices to access a different serial
 port (the TT has 4).


                 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~  more....

 Message     43, Wed Nov 24, 1993 J.HURLEY1 [Jim Hurley]

 Jim,

         I thought there was a mouse topic also, but I could not find
 it either.

         In any case mice are a very personal topic, everyone has
 their favorite.  There is at least one fully optical mouse for the
 Atari.  I don't remember who's it is at the moment, I am sure someone
 will.  The company that makes them make several mice including
 optico/mechanical.  You might try giving one of the larger Atari
 Retailers a call.

 >> Joe M <<

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 45        Thu Nov 25, 1993
W.DAVIS20 [W.D.]             at 08:54 EST

PAUL,

        Listen to Joe.  I had a supra30 go T*Ts up on me.  Same symtems as
your having.  Ofcourse I got mine going several times by lifting it up a 1/2"
off the table and dropping it just as I heard the little clicking Supras make.
GL  :)

Regards,

W.D.

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 46        Thu Nov 25, 1993
A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt]       at 09:41 EST

Mark,

Any computer store should have an RS232 switchbox. I bought three of them for
$12 each a while back. You can also get them by mailorder.

Al

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 47        Thu Nov 25, 1993
J.ZENTZ1 [wintermane]        at 14:09 EST

 Yes buy an optical mouse for your atari. I think TOAD sells them .
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 48        Thu Nov 25, 1993
J.BRENNER1 [See Flat]        at 18:12 EST

 Mark,
 For many years I used a sync box and a modem hooked up together on
 my ST. I bought a ribbon cable that had a male and female DB25 and
 bought an extra male connector that that clamps onto the ribbon.
 So for about 8 dollars I made an RS232 Y-Jack. It works perfectly
 and is much cheaper than a swithing mechanism.

 John B.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 49        Thu Nov 25, 1993
F.LAWRENCE2 [FRANK]          at 21:23 EST

Jim,

I too went through many 'meeces' but have now used the Beetle mouse for over a
year with very little problems - somethimes I just pick it up and lightly
bounce it on the pad and squares it away if it dosent like to move the sprite.
I may do that once a month at the most. It has been a Super mouse for me.

                             Frank

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 50        Thu Nov 25, 1993
P.GRIFFITH2 [PGRIF]          at 22:14 EST

 I recently got a Golden Image optical mouse. It has no rpller, just a special
pad with a very fine grid drawn on it which you must use if you want the mouse
to track correctly. The mouse slides over the pad riding on what appear to be
felt pads. I am finding this mouse to be harder to use the more I use it. Any
dust that settles onto the pad gets stuck to the felt. After two months of
use(and keeping the mouse and pad covered when not in use), the mouse is very
hard to move smoothly. It seems to catch slightly if I put any but the
slightest hand pressure on it, and then as I push a bit harder to break it
loose, jumps a bit, often past where I was trying to move it. This mouse will
go in the junk pile as soon as I can afford to buy another. I have an older GI
250C mouse that works very well for me, I hope to find another one of these.
 I got the optical mouse from Toad, I don't have it's model number or Toad's
phone number handy at the moment, but I'm sure somebody else can supply this
info.
 Paul
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 51        Fri Nov 26, 1993
M.EASTER [Mike]              at 14:13 EST

Jim Hurley - re msg 43, Wed 931124

 > I have a problem with any mouse device that uses rolling parts.
 > Inevitably the rollers get coated with gunk, often in a few hours
 > and the rolling action becomes erratic and annoying. When I can't
 > stand it any longer I open them up and clean the rollers.

Re "often in a few hours"

No wonder you are frustrated with mechanical mice!  If the short time between
roller maintenances is your main gripe with your mechanical mice, rather than
the ergometrics of different mouse designs; here's some advice that might be
helpful.

Number 1: adequate cleaning of the rollers.  The rollers should not have
residual wax after cleaning.  There are many different methods that others
have posted in the past about how to clean the rollers; ranging from careful
sharp removal with a blade to use of a solvent, such as alcohol or other, for
final cleanup.  Ideally the rollers should look spotless after cleaning,
unless they have already been scratched with a sharp method.  You should also
wash and rinse the rubber ball, for the oil and wax reasons below.

Number 2: periodic maintenance of your mouse pad.  I don't know what kind of
mouse pad you have, but the mouse pad is the source of the gunk that gets onto
the rollers.  In my case, I use (and have a spare) a mouse pad called Mouse
Mat.  Its top surface is a synthetic cloth, which comes in various colors, and
its under surface is a rubber foam.  It is fairly easy to clean.

The mouse pad accumulates the natural hand oils, dead skin cells with waxy
content, dirt, lint, tars from cigarette smoke and other debris.  If you use a
dry stiff brush you can see a pile of the dry form of the junk which
contaminates your mouse rollers.  After brushing off the dry stuff; I use the
same stiff brush with soapy water to scrub away the oily, waxy, tarry dirt and
lint; followed by rinsing to eliminate the soap film, and air drying before re-
use.  That's where the spare comes in handy.

With proper maintenance of the rollers and mouse pad, you should be able to go
for months between cleaning; unless you are working in an especially oily,
dirty, tarry environment.

Mike Easter
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 52        Sat Nov 27, 1993
G.LEONE [Gerry]              at 21:27 EST

General question:  I recently saw a PC Ditto board (I don't know if it was PC
Ditto I or PC Ditto II) and docs at a consignment store for $25.

My question is: is it worth it?  Will it run IBM programs?  What should I know
about this thing?

I'm running a 4-meg STe w/ TOS 1.62.

Thanks in advance!

 --Gerry
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 53        Sat Nov 27, 1993
A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt]       at 23:51 EST

Gerry,

pc ditto (lower case!) is software; pc ditto II is hardware.

Many users had a lot of problems getting the pcdII boards to work.

When they do work, they let you run just about any DOS software. I'd look for
a copy of pc ditto (software) instead; it is slow, but works very, very well.

Al

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 54        Sun Nov 28, 1993
W.DAVIS20 [W.D.]             at 08:44 EST

Gerry,

        I have had bad luck with PC Ditto 2.  If there is a board, it is PCD
2.  PCD 1 is SW only.  If you buy, there is one thing I think you should know.
If your not used to working inside computers, have a pro install it.  If you
do it yourself, remember this.  The small board that fits over the CPU must
fit VERY TIGHT!!!  It should fit on with a SNAP sound.  If it just slides on,
forget it. it won't work. I have one in my old ST and I doesn't even work any
more.
        I now have the SuperCharger and I like it much better.  It has more to
offer and to install, you don't open your machine.  MHO.

Regards,

W.D.

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 55        Sun Nov 28, 1993
K.SPRINGER1 [FROZEN NORTH]   at 13:57 EST

Gerry,

W.D. is right about the tight fit requirements.  I followed Avant Garde's
instructions and soldered mine to the 68000 chip, and never had another
problem.

Also, CGA graphics resolution is the best you can get, and I believe that is
also true of the Supercharger.

I have no experience with the Supercharger, but I think, based on what I've
read, that it is the better of the two ways, especially if you have some
serious DOS stuff to do.  I have the impression that it works just a bit
better.

Doesn't the SC let you use the ST RAM as a DOS ramdisk, and vice-versa, when
properly set up?

Ken S.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 56        Sun Nov 28, 1993
G.LEONE [Gerry]              at 23:15 EST

Thanks for the pc ditto info, one and Al (sic)!

  -Gerry

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 57        Mon Nov 29, 1993
W.DAVIS20 [W.D.]             at 23:55 EST

 Hello,

        I've just started using the Link.  I'm wondering if there are any
programs on the ICD Link disk that should go into my auto folder? I'm using it
with a Floptical Disk Drive.  I also have a SuperCharger.
        I am also having a problem with the SuperCharger.  It bombs when I'm
in Med Rez.  I set it up in Hi Rez and it works fine that way.  Any help will
be appriciated.

Thanks,

W.D.

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message  58       Mon Nov 29, 1993
T.BURTON                     (Forwarded)

I recently yanked the roms from my mega 2 rev 5 motherboard. I can't remember
how they go back in. I know where they go, and the way chips should face in
the sockets, I just don't know how they go in numerically. ie. Which sockets
are low numbers, which are high. Please help. Thanks.

Shane
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 59        Tue Nov 30, 1993
M.PAULI [Small Mike]         at 06:46 EST

   I need help with the hookup of a D.E.K.A.

   The used unit had only the 18-pin-connector in it which will not work on my
520 STFM of newer production. My 520 needs the 7-pin connector to work.

  If someone could just give me a description of *how* the connector is wired
e.g. which colored cable goes to which pin, I could do the rest on my own by
"re-working" my given connector...

  Thanks for any help!


          Mike

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 60        Tue Nov 30, 1993
J.BRENNER1 [See Flat]        at 18:56 EST

Shane,
      I think it is printed on the board "lo" "hi" The roms are
 also identified.

 John B.

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 61        Wed Dec 01, 1993
T.THEDELL [todo 2]           at 00:49 EST

I finally shelved my pcdittoII due to too many problems.  I applaud anyone
that has it running!
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 62        Wed Dec 01, 1993
GENIELAMP.ST [John G]        at 02:33 EST

W.D.

 Nope, no AUTO folder programs to worry about - the ICD boot software
 takes care of all of that.

 I, too, own a floptical!  Here's a sage word of advice - DON'T TRY TO
 FORMAT THEM!  They come pre-low-level-formatted.  All you need to do
 is partition them with the ICDFMT.PRG.  I learned the hard way and
 had to have Al Fasoldt save my worthless hide by formatting one I
 attempted to format.

 John


 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 63        Wed Dec 01, 1993
M.PAULI [Small Mike]         at 04:09 EST



    John,

  Don't be afraid of low-level-formatting floptical disks! Some 3M-disks I
bought recently were not formatted at all and my ICD-software got really
confused...nothing at all on a disk!

  I couldn't get ICDFRMT to even recognize the disk...after a few trials I
just gave up on it and hooked the Floptical to the SCSI-connector of my synth,
formatted one minute or so and went back to ATARI and ICD.
 Now ICDFRMT would acknowledge the disk and hard-formatted the disk in the
typical 25 min. or so.

  I tried out different interleaves on flop-disks and remember that an
interleave of one is NOT the fastest data-transfer...but I forgot which was
the fastest...I think it was 2...

  (BTW, I got your PFM+ Monday...thanks a lot! It is just what I needed!)


                 Mike

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 64        Wed Dec 01, 1993
W.DAVIS20 [W.D.]             at 21:13 EST

Frozen North,

        How did you manage to get the (I'll call it the backside) of the PC
Ditto board soldered to the 68000 chip?  I have a big socket sitting there
next to it and between that socket and the little PC Ditto connection board,
theres no way I could get in there with a Soldering Iron.  I still have the
thing in my ST2 and would love to get it working.  I soldered the one side
that I could get to, which was tricky enough, but not the back side as I
couldn't get to it.

Regards,

W.D.

PS  Yes the SC does give you a RAM disk.  You can have a 1 meg RAM disk from
the SC without using Atari RAM while in TOS.  You can also use TOS Ram as a
RAM disk while in DOS.

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 65        Wed Dec 01, 1993
W.DAVIS20 [W.D.]             at 21:54 EST

John,

        Thanks for the input.  Your hide is not worthless.  I saw the
conversation between you and Al, and he has saved lots of Hides. Point being
that your situation helped me and you answered my question about the ICD
software.
        If you help someone else you are hardly "worthless".  :)

Thanks,

W.D.

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 66        Wed Dec 01, 1993
A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt]       at 23:15 EST

Mike,

All Flopticals are, indeed, formatted.

Al

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 67        Thu Dec 02, 1993
GENIELAMP.ST [John G]        at 01:34 EST

Mike,

  -\    I couldn't get ICDFRMT to even recognize the           \-
  -\  disk...after a few trials I  just gave up on it and      \-
  -\  hooked the Floptical to the SCSI-connector of my         \-
  -\  synth, formatted one minute or so and went back to       \-
  -\  ATARI and ICD.                                           \-

 Hooked it up to your _what_!  Since I didn't have a synth I was stuck
 dead in the water (the ICDFMT.PRG won't low-level format the suckers
 - times out or somthing)

 Glad you got the package - I was sorely tempted to open it up and try
 it, but I was certain it didn't print checks...

 John

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 68        Thu Dec 02, 1993
M.PAULI [Small Mike]         at 05:23 EST

   Al,

  Yes, all Floptical disks are formatted (low level)....
  ...with the exception of those that are not!

  Just wait till you buy one of those I got...but I got them for a
  better price ($34/2pack).


         Mike




    John,

   Any Floptical disk that has "low level formatted" stamped on it should be
formatted by ICDFRMT.PRG.  The program that came with my LINK did work just
fine after a few trials.

   ICD-software that deals with Flopticals seems still to be a bit buggy, the
latest ICD-PRO HD-booter disables my SUPERBOOT no matter what I try to prevent
it. I finally went back to an older version of ICDBOOT.PRG and it worked as
before.

   ICDFRMT does not like big RAM-disks (1.5 M) in the background or it can't
partition or format my Flopticals.
   So far I've always found workarounds...

   I use the Floptical either on my ATARI or for my synthesizer K2000, the
synth uses a different format and does his own formatting thru the SCSI-port.
It takes ~25 min. as well. So I've different formatted disks for different
uses, neither can be read by the other machine though...


   (BTW, PFM+ does NOT print checks, but other than that it *is* a great
program to analyze budgets and accounts!)


 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 69        Thu Dec 02, 1993
T.BURTON                     at 06:18 EST

Anyone know of an inexpensive source for 64 pin inline cpu sockets? $7 apiece
seems a bit pricey.

Shane
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 70        Thu Dec 02, 1993
P.THOMPSON19 [PAUL]          at 08:29 EST

I had an optical mouse on a PC and HATED it.  I've used a Golden Image mouse
for a couple of years and haven't had to take it apart yet.  I've also heard
many good things about the Beetle Mouse.

                        Paul

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 71        Thu Dec 02, 1993
ICDINC                       at 10:15 EST

Mike, Why are you recomending that people format their floptical disks after
they have been "low level" formatted at the factory?  This is just not true.

You also claim that our software is buggy.  Also not true.

We have a means for fixing bugs in our software.  If a user sends us a bug
report in Email, we act on it.  This is the first I have heard of your problem
with RAMDISKs over 1.5M and Superboot.

We support two different formats on the 21MB Floptical diskettes. The first
does not allow autobooting but follows the industry standard. THat format
should work on any other platform that follows the standards.

The second is "Atari compatible" and formats the disk just like any hard drive
with boot sectors and partitions.   If your synth is Atari compatible in its
format than this method should work in both systems for interchangability.

Howard also confirmed that our software does perform a low level format on a
floptical.  We just don't recomend it since it is slow and takes 25 minutes.

        - TOM -

PS We also have a Round Table here on GEnie for support of ICD products.
m1220;1 will get you there or ICD from a main prompt.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 72        Thu Dec 02, 1993
TQUINN [Terry~Sysop]         at 13:24 EST


 >        How did you manage to get the (I'll call it the backside) of the PC
 >Ditto board soldered to the 68000 chip?  I have a big socket sitting there
 >next to it and between that socket and the little PC Ditto connection board,
 >theres no way I could get in there with a Soldering Iron.  I still have the
 >thing in my ST2 and would love to get it working.  I soldered the one side
 >that I could get to, which was tricky enough, but not the back side as I
 >couldn't get to it.

The best way to do this (if you are a technician with the proper tools) is to
carefully solder the legs of the clip to a 68000 chip OUTSIDE the ST. Then
remove the 68000 from your computer, install a socket and plug the whole thing
in.  Works like a charm!

Terry Quinn

ST RT Sysop and BBS Janitor

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 73        Thu Dec 02, 1993
K.SPRINGER1 [FROZEN NORTH]   at 22:43 EST

W.D.

 >        How did you manage to get the (I'll call it the backside) of the PC
 >Ditto board soldered to the 68000 chip?  I have a big socket sitting there
 >next to it and between that socket and the little PC Ditto connection board,
 >theres no way I could get in there with a Soldering Iron.  I still have the
 >thing in my ST2 and would love to get it working.  I soldered the one side
 >that I could get to, which was tricky enough, but not the back side as I
 >couldn't get to it.

Got a hunch that quote above will look terrible after GEnie and Aladdin are
done with it!

 >The best way to do this (if you are a technician with the proper tools) is
to
 >carefully solder the legs of the clip to a 68000 chip OUTSIDE the ST. Then
 >remove the 68000 from your computer, install a socket and plug the whole
thing
 >in.  Works like a charm!
 >
 >Terry Quinn

Terry's solution is a good one, and is just more sophiticated than the way I
did mine.  First, I had no access to a second 68000 or socket (I'm sort of off
the beaten path, ya know!) so that option was out.  Second, my installation
was in an old 1040STf.  Apparently, there were quite a few different layouts
internally for these models. Had I done the socket thingy, I may not have been
able to get it back together.  I had to leave off a portion of the RF
shielding as it was.  In addition, I had to take a file to the long edges of
the board and narrower it up some to get it to fit.  I also had to add extra
electrical insulation (a piece of manilla file folder) between the keyboard
and the PC Ditto II board.  Some type of shorting was happening here.

Anyway..... Since my 68000 was soldered in, I cleaned the ribbon cable clip
thoroughly, and the legs on the 68000 as best I could.  I used some fine wire
solder and a low wattage (25W) pencil type soldering gun.  I held the solder
against a leg of the clip first, then applied the heat to the underside
(soldered side) of the circuit board.  The very second the fine wire solder
flowed between the clip leg and the 68000 leg, I took the heat away.  Didn't
have to redo a single joint!  I did do a leg on opposite corner in an "X"
pattern first, so the clip could not slip out of place.  Then is was just a
matter of time an patience to do the rest.

Some people actually ran the ribbon cables to the outside, and put the board
in a separate box.  My 1040 suffers a bad bulge in the top because of spatial
constraints.  Hmm, there was some timing problems with some of the ST's, and
it required replacing a chip or two on the Ditto board.  Honestly don't
remember, but I think I had to do this. I discovered the necessity of the
keyboard insulation when it would work with the top off, but not with the top
on.

There was an article some time back in one of the ST mags about installing the
board.  This is after Avant Garde disappeared.  As I remember, the technician
in the article never had a bad board, just had to make sure the clip
connection to the 68000 was good.  Still have the article somewhere. <G>

Hope this dissertation helps!

Ken S.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 74        Thu Dec 02, 1993
GENIELAMP.ST [John G]        at 23:31 EST

Thanks, W.D.!

 Al certainly is a hide-saver, isn't he!

 John


 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 75        Fri Dec 03, 1993
M.PAULI [Small Mike]         at 23:35 EST

   Tom,

  You might want to read my messages a little bit more careful or better yet:
READ THEM IN THE FIRST PLACE!

  If you would go back and check in the ICD topic for messages under my name
you would find that I repeatedly asked for advice for my small problems with
ICDBOOT and SUPERBOOT. I finally just gave up on getting an answer...

  You promised to check with Howard on the SUPERBOOT-program but that is close
to a month ago.

  I find it quite funny that I finally get some attention from ICD in a topic
that is only faintly related to ICD...

  This is getting far off topic now and I don't want to get more into that. So
I suggest that you get your facts straighten out before you tell me what is
impossible and what isn't...

  P.S. If you *really* want to help your customers then type m1220;1 and read
ALL the messages...and answer them if you care.


 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 76        Sat Dec 04, 1993
W.DAVIS20 [W.D.]             at 05:22 EST

Terry,

        OK!  I see what you mean.  Well, maybe someday, when I have time to
kill (what a laugh that is) I'll do that.  That is quite a bit of work though.
Thanks for the info.

Frozen North,

        Ummmmm.  Now theres an idea.  Now I just wonder how much work is
involved with pulling the mother board (I take it that is the board your
talking about) to get to the underside of it in my Mega ST2?  It does sound
like a good option.
        I'll just have to open the thing back up and see which option is more
a more likely method for me.

Regards,

W.D.


 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 77        Sat Dec 04, 1993
ICDINC                       at 08:26 EST

Small Mike, Flame out and then come back to the ICD RT.

We do sincerely try to help people here and in 1220.

Howard does receive all pertinent messages.  He is also very busy.

Topic threads are not completely accurate as many problems are taken to EMAIL
for continued details.  IF you have more to say, this will also be in EMAIL as
I will not waste anymore GEnie customer time reading over this ********!

 - TOM -
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 78        Sat Dec 04, 1993
K.SPRINGER1 [FROZEN NORTH]   at 13:42 EST

W.D.

 >        Ummmmm.  Now theres an idea.  Now I just wonder how much work is
 >involved with pulling the mother board (I take it that is the board your
 >talking about) to get to the underside of it in my Mega ST2?  It does sound
 >like a good option.

Correct-a-mundo!  As for removing it, I would guess it is held in place with
screws somewhere near the corners.  Assuming the Mega2 is like my Mega4, you
might have to do silly things like remove the power supply, floppy drive, etc,
to get all the screws.  I don't remember what, if anything, held my 1040 STf
motherboard down.  Been a long time since I put it in, Avant Garde Systems was
still with us. I'd look in the 1040, but it is 3,000 miles away!  In Colorado.

Ken S.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 79        Sat Dec 04, 1993
STEPHENSON [Bob in ABQ]      at 18:16 EST

Tom at ICD,

   I'm sure you want to believe what you say about your service.  But Howard
is _always_ very busy, and things don't always get tended to.

      Bob in Albuquerque
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 80        Sat Dec 04, 1993
A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt]       at 23:12 EST

Small Mike,

Of ALL the people who care about Ataris, Tom Harker holds the degree of Doctor
of Continual Ministrations. He is hardly likely to have ignored you. Tom is
one of the best friends the Atari community ever had.

Al

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 81        Sun Dec 05, 1993
M.PAULI [Small Mike]         at 04:33 EST


    Tom,

 > IF you have more to say, this will also be in EMAIL as I will not<
 > waste anymore GEnie customer time reading over this ********!    <

   I'm sorry but I decide WHAT I say and WHERE...and this ********
 might just be necessary to be spelled out.

   I'm also talking hardware here...I got one of the first Flopticals
 which shipped with a LINK and ICD-software. Since the ICD-manual
 didn't even mention the Floptical once I had to find my own way thru
 the "SCSI-maze".
   My PLI-Floptical died on me once and damaged four disks in the
 process, PLI replaced the unit under warranty but not the disks.
   I had no problems since and still recommend the technology to
 anybody who listens.
   I learned a lot of things along the way of using the Floptical,
 e.g. that there are at least three different ways of formatting-
 schemes, depending on the used platform or even synth...

   When I bought the newer ICD-PRO-software I hoped for a vastly
 improved manual and updated programs. The manual was a disapointment
 for me and the updated ICDBOOT interfered with SUPERBOOT 8.1 in that
 it prevented it from running.

   My questions in the ICD-topic (p 1220) regarding these matters
 were never answered in a decent way. Other customers were having
 similar problems and at least on one occasion started to SHOUT their
 questions in capital letters.
   Anybody can read the threads of the last month or so to confirm my
 statements.

   I do not have so much of a problem with "imperfect" software, we
 computer-users learn to live with a few compromises. But I *DO* have
 a problem with the way that I'm treated as a customer of ICD.

   I'm not some kid that just bought his first hard-drive and can't
 or won't read his manual.

   There is a minimum of courtesy that most companies extend to their
 customers...usually. I do not expect: "The customer is always right!"
 but there should be a minimum of respect for people who buy products
 with their hard-earned money.

   I *DO* respect ICD as a company that supports ATARI but I think
 that you should seriously "re-think" your attitude...


   It might make more sense for me to call Howard if I need any
 future advice...I know, he's busy...so am I at times...



                                 Mike


  ....And now we resume our normal programming...;-)


 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 82        Sun Dec 05, 1993
K.SPRINGER1 [FROZEN NORTH]   at 15:03 EST

Al, Small Mike, ICD (Tom),

First off, I am not mad at anyone, the following is just my
experiences.....and comments.

Tom,

I have to agree with Small Mike, company support in your RT is not as good as
you feel it is.  I used to follow the Atari topics there, and found it
difficult to get the few questions I asked answered.  Not anywhere near as
good of support as DMC and the Codeheads provide here.  Questions there rarely
have to be repeated.  As I remember, some my questions in your RT were never
answered.  I have found questions go unanswered in other RT's and topics also.

Like Small Mike,  I have a couple of small questions, but they are not
important enough to bother with, given my past experiences, and since I have
found work arounds for them.

I also expected an updated and improved manual for the Pro software. After
all, if it is "Pro", there ought to be some major difference that gets
explained.

At the same time, I know the Atari market may totally disappear, and ICD is in
business to make a profit.  You can't devote all your time and resources to
marginal areas.  But you also cannot ignore any customer's request.  If word
of mouth is truly one of the best methods of advertising, you certainly don't
want bad feelings being circulated this way.  Bad news travels fast they say.
:-)

As for calling Howard.....  Please don't forget that for many users, that may
require making the call on the boss's time, something the boss may frown upon!
That makes written correspondence and online support the only viable method
for some users to obtain ICD support. And I know that from the business end,
written methods are very labor intensive and costly.

As I mentioned at the beginning, I'm not mad at anyone.  Please take this as
suggestions as to what needs improving, and throw in a lot of platitudes like
"To close to the trees to see the forest", etc.


Sincerely,

Ken S.


 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message  83       Sun Dec 05, 1993
R.JOHNSON9 [Opus]            (Forwarded)

Well, I'm not sure if this is the perfect place to post this, but I'm sure
I'll be told if it isn't! :)

What I would really love to do is upgrade my current 520STfm or grab a cheap
MegaST and have 4mb of RAM, better graphics (640x480x256 at least!), and an
ability to sample sounds from CD's.  The problem I have is the costs as
compared to the IBM clones.  If I was to grab a MegaST (much easier for the
video upgrade) used, I would be paying $200-250.   Add a video upgrade for
another $500+ (!) and monitor ($150 or so used) and I'm looking at a very well
equiped 386DX40 which is supported!   (for the sake of argument, we'll call it
even on the sound board)

Now, I love my ST even though I've had it barely a year and I'm not looking to
trade it away.  It is just very hard for me to justify putting this kind of
money into a machine that was sold with the slogan 'Power without the price.'

I guess I should stop complaining and ask a few questions.

Firstly, what are the available graphics cards and what kind of resolution and
compatibility do they offer?  Are any installable on an old 520STfm? Secondly,
what kind of sound cards are there available?  I've seen the ad for Oregon
Research's Replay 16 which looks very impressive and probably well worth the
$250 they are asking for it.

Any thoughts or suggestions are GREATLY appreciated! Any personal opinions on
any available boards that you may be using or have used will also be greatly
appreciated!

By the way...what the hell is GDOS?
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 84        Mon Dec 06, 1993
A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt]       at 08:00 EST

Opus,

Graphics cards work only with models that have a card slot (Mega STe and TT)
or with the old Mega ST, which has an internal connection for a card. Yes, you
are absolutely right; you can buy a PC for the cost of upgrading an ST.
Whether this means anything, only the user can determine. You'd end up with a
PC. I use a lot of PCs daily, and am in charge of 100 of them, and have no
interest in replacing my ST and TT with a PC, especially now that my TT uses a
graphics card.

Graphics cards vary in their quality. The lesser ones provide two additional
resolutions from the standard ones, 800X600 and 1024X768, both with 16 colors.
This is hardly adequate for graphics, but is fine for word processing. The
better cards such as the Crazy Dots II allow up to 32,000 colors and up to
1600X1200 resolution, give or take a few pixels, and have accelerated
displays. My CDII makes the TT faster than any of the Windows PCs I program
for in the way it handles the display.

I don't know anything about sound cards for the Atari, since the STe and TT
already have that built in. Before you buy a sound card for an older ST, you
might reconsider a Mega STe, which offers stereo digital sound (and can play
Windows WAV files, Amiga MOD files, and many other formats) and, of course,
can take a graphics card. It also has a 16 MHz processor, instead of the ST's
8 MHz.

Al

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 85        Mon Dec 06, 1993
D.KAUFMAN [d.a.k.]           at 19:39 EST

The stiction problem:

I had a Supra 30mb (Seagate) purchased in 1989 for my 1040ST.  In 1992 it
began to have stiction problems.  I would have to turn it on and off two to
three times before it would spin.  After about the 5th time, I ordered a
Quantum 52LPS scsi drive to replace it, and never looked back.  I did have to
drill a couple of holes in the Supra case but it worked great, and still works
inside the MSTE 4 I now have (and I put the Seagate that came with the MSTE in
the Supra box).  Also, the Quantum spins up almost immediately while I always
have to wait a few precious seconds for the Seagate.

At the first sign of stiction, replace the drive.  They're even cheaper now
than in 1992.

dak
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 86        Tue Dec 07, 1993
R.MORROW10 [Bob M.]          at 20:17 EST

Might want to try the program DCNOSTIC which is probably here.  Run it from
AUTO to periodically jiggle the hard drive heads.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message  89       Wed Dec 08, 1993
S.INGRAM                     (Forwarded)

Greetings.  This may be the wrong area but I have just one question.  Can
ANYONE direct me to the nearest printed circuit board maker software.  I have
no idea were to look.  I am willing to look overseas.


                                           THANX

                                              - SCOTT -
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 90        Thu Dec 09, 1993
J.BRENNER1 [See Flat]        at 05:47 EST

 Scott,

 From Atari International software catalogue

 Mega PCB
 PCB Edit             Rosin Datentechnik
                      GERMANY
                      TEL: +49 6723 4978

 PCB Layout Plus      Ingenieurbtro praefcke
                      GERMANY
                      TEL: +49 434 7531

 Platon v2.2          VHF Computer
                      GERMANY
                      TEL: +49 703 165 0660

 John B.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 92        Wed Dec 15, 1993
D.BRYANT12 [DAN BRYANT]      at 00:45 EST

I have a MegaSTE which I would like to link with two 386s for the purpose of
sharing a common data file which I use with a Mac program (Omnis) and Spectre
GCR.  Can it be done???  Obviously, I would prefer to access the file while
running GCR.  I would love to hear from anyone doing this.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 93        Thu Dec 16, 1993
F.LAWRENCE2 [FRANK]          at 00:18 EST

Dan,

It is possible to link with some 'networking' software. Novell will let you
link 'Macs' with 'clones', of course this is BIG BUCKS. You might get into
STInformers cat and check out with Rod the networking software he as available
thru A&D.

                                   Frank


 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 94        Thu Dec 16, 1993
K.KJELVIK                    at 21:34 EST

I need a little Help!!!
 Does anyone Know how to adjust or what component needs to be replaced in a
Atari SC1224 (Samsung) Color Monitor to Correct a Pin Cushion Problem ???? For
those of you  whom don't know what Pin Cushion is .. Pin Cushion is a
Adjustment to straighten out the sides of your Picture.. So,that the sides of
your screen doesn't bend inward like  this  ) ( ....   Anyone any Clues ????
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 95        Tue Dec 28, 1993
G.LEONE [Gerry]              at 00:57 EST

Another of those questions...

Does anybody know if an Apple II (or an Apple II GS, to be exact) disk format
for a 3.5" is compatible with an ST's format?  Or, like the Macintosh, does
Apple format its disks completely differently?

I ask because my in-laws just bought a used IIGS, and I thought I'd download
some programs for them if I could.

Thanks in advance!

  -Gerry
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 96        Tue Dec 28, 1993
K.ESTES [Kenne@SFRT]         at 01:11 EST

Interesting question. I know there's a II emulator for the Mac LC...

Beats me.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 97        Tue Dec 28, 1993
DAEDWARDS [Warrl]            at 02:31 EST

Gerry:

I would heavily bet against formatting a disk on a GS and reading or writing
it on any other machine.  That would be sensible, therefore Apple didn't do it
that way.  :-)

What is more likely is that the GS can read true IBM format.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 98        Wed Dec 29, 1993
J.BRENNER1 [See Flat]        at 18:28 EST

 Al,
    I dont' remember in which topic you suggested SysInfo but
 I guess you must be in this topic also! (hope). As always, <g>
 I've downloaded something you suggested and am not regretting
 it. SysInfo is giving me tons of info which I have no idea
 of it's meaning! ;-) It is however very interesting to see the
 status of the system. This leads me to this question, When I'm
 in 68000 mode I get a 8mhz reading of the clock speed. (normal!)
 when I'm in the Turbo 030 68030 mode I get a 64mhz clock speed!
 This is fine with me <g> but it makes me wonder if the info is
 accurate. The Fast Technologie card is marketed  as having a
 50 mhz speed. What type of clockspeed do you get on your TT?
 Sysinfo also telling me that I have 0 TT ram. (I have 4) and
 it then tells me I have 3600kb available. For a total of
 7meg or whatever. (I also have 4meg st ram) Is it just not
 seing the ram to begin with because I have a 1040? Funny how
 it adds the two correctly.

 John B.

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 99        Thu Dec 30, 1993
A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt]       at 07:37 EST

John,

Yes, it sounds like it's getting confused by the integers it is picking up.
The TT shows 32MHz, 4/4 (the right readings).

64MHz, eh? Well, I'd just settle on that. John. Sounds better than 50!

Al


 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 100       Thu Dec 30, 1993
STEVE-J [DrHfuhruhurr]       at 08:11 EST

HELP!


I just bought a used 440MB SCSI hard drive mechanism and it won't get
recognized (ICD's IDCHECK.PRG and formatter don't recognize it)!

It's a "Hewlett Packard D1685A 94241-502 440MB Single End SCSI Disk Drive"
that's manufactured by Seagate.

The jumper selection looks like:

 19 . . . . . . . . . . 1
          |           |  ----> current jumpers
 20 . . . . . . . . . . 2


Any ideas???  Any and all help will be GREATLY appreciated.  Thanks!
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 101       Thu Dec 30, 1993
ICDINC                       at 08:48 EST

Steve, YOu need to disable parity and make sure that term power is there. I
will look for info on that drive when I get to work.

 - TOM -
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 102       Thu Dec 30, 1993
ICDINC                       at 11:24 EST

OK Steve.  Here it is.

THe drive is a Seagate ST-2502N/CDC Wren 6 HH SCSI unit. THe diagram that you
left showed 11 jumper pairs so it is unclear since there are 10 pairs. I
called the Seagate SeaFax line for a faxback copy of details. YOu can do the
same if you have a fax machine.  The SeaFAx number is  408-438-2620 The
document number for your drive is 25023.

IF you don't have a fax, here are the details that you need. There are 10
pairs (sets) of jumper pins.  Pins 1 & 2 are pair 1, 3 & 4 are pair 2, etc.
Pair 1 is the furthest away from the SCSI connector. All pairs (1-10) should
be open except for: Pair 9 which puts term power on the bus.  (If this doesn't
work try pair 10 instead after removing the jumper at 9.) Pairs 6,7,8 are the
SCSI ID pairs.  6 is the 4s bit, 7 the 2s bit, and 8 the 1s bit.

THat should be all the jumpers used.  Pair 4 must be opened to disable parity.
IF closed, parity is enabled.

This should be all you need.

        Good luck.

    - TOM -
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 103       Fri Dec 31, 1993
STEVE-J [DrHfuhruhurr]       at 01:40 EST

Thanks, Tom!  Unfortunately, I don't have time to do it before I go to work
and will have to wait until I get home. <sniff>  Anyway, as you described it,
I received it with jumpers on pairs 4 and 10.


(later)

Ack!  It still doesn't work.  With a jumper only on pair 9, the drive doesn't
even start spinning (but the light comes on), but on pair 10, the drive WILL
start spinning, but won't get recognized.  Could it be something with my SCSI
cable (even though it works fine with an ST-296N)?  It worked fine on the PC
that the guy who I bought it from showed it to me on.  I KNOW the SCSI cable
isn't in great shape (I had a few problems with it several years ago when I
had a 32MB RLL drive), so maybe there's some slightly different signals that
aren't making it through???
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 104       Fri Dec 31, 1993
ICDINC                       at 09:28 EST

Steve, Try moving the jumper from pair 9 to pair 10.

  - TOM -
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 105       Fri Dec 31, 1993
K.FENNELL [Kenfen]           at 17:31 EST

Hi, I'm Ken Fennell from Atlanta, and I have an old 520stfm thast I'd like to
upgrade to at least a Meg of ram to use as a backup to  my 1040. Anybody know
where I might find a memory expansion board for that thing?    Thanx HNY!!!!!
Kenfen
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 107       Sat Jan 01, 1994
A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt]       at 12:43 EST

Ken,

Glad to see you here! Stick with us; these are interesting times.

One of the regulars here will have an answer. I've never upgraded a 520, just
a 1040, and that was a long time back.

Al

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 108       Sun Jan 02, 1994
STEVE-J [DrHfuhruhurr]       at 01:05 EST

Well, I figured out my hard drive questions, so they no longer need to be
answered.  Thanks for the help!
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 109       Sun Jan 02, 1994
D.FARRINGTO1 [David <><  .]  at 01:57 EST

Ken:

Have you looked at the mother board of the 520STFM?  The cheepest way to get
the 520 to one meg is to fill in the second row of memory chips on the board
if the row is there.  I think the 520STFM came with the second row.  Let us
know and we can take you futher.

David <><
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 110       Sun Jan 02, 1994
J.HURLEY1 [Jim Hurley]       at 02:26 EST

A little while back I posted about some mouse problems I was having - all my
mice (I have 3 or 4) get gunked up frequently and stopped moving freely after
a short time.

Replies indicated this was highly unusual (I would suppose!), so I worked on
the problem. I think I found the culprit.

What seems to be happening is this - the axes on which the rollers in the
mouse are mounted seem to be gunked. After a while this causes the rollers to
move sluggishly and pick up more gunk from the mouse ball which contacts them
and forces the motion.

What I did was clean the axes as much as I could and spray them with WD-40 to
lubricate them. Next I sprayed the whole mouse assembly with a degreaser and
cleaner (Blue Thunder) while protecting the axes so as not to remove the WD-
40.

For the last few weeks I have trouble-free mouse operation - and much smoother
than I ever had before!!

Hope this helps someone else...
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 111       Sun Jan 02, 1994
M.EASTER [Mike]              at 05:01 EST

Jim - re mouse cleaning

Good!  Now don't forget your mouse pad cleaning, see my msg. 51 this topic.

Mike Easter
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 112       Sun Jan 02, 1994
J.MEEHAN3 [>> Joe M << ]     at 08:14 EST

Message  10, Sun Jan 02, 1994 J.HURLEY1 [Jim Hurley]

 Jim,

         I once tried the WD-40 trick, but I had a devil of a time
 cleaning it off the parts I did not want it on.  I wish I had thought
 of using a degreaser at that time. <grin>

 >> Joe M <<

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 113       Sun Jan 02, 1994
P.GRIFFITH2 [PGRIF]          at 11:30 EST

 I just finished getting my Mega 4(Mega 2 with 2 megs added) running after
installing an accelerator. I did some bad desoldering, but finally have the
machine to the point where it will boot all of the way to a desktop. It has
TOS 2.06 installed. The first time that I run any program, the machine crashes
with 11 bombs. This is a LINE-F vector problem and supposedly means that LOW
memory is failing. Even before I tried the accelerator mod, I'd been having
problems that an Atari dealer said sounded like intermittent memory failure.
 TOS 2.06 does a memory check when the machine is first turned on and tells me
that all 4 megs are fine.
 Question: Is there any memory test software that will run at 16mhz? I have
RAMTEST.TOS, but it doesn't work any more, used to work at 8mhz. Which banks
of memory are LOW memory. SYSINFO.PRG will tell me some things about memory
location, but I can't interperet it.
  Thanks.
        Paul
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 114       Sun Jan 02, 1994
A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt]       at 12:42 EST

Jim Jurley,

Glad to hear you have solved the mouse problem! May I offer a tip, one that I
have passed along to newspaper readers for years: WD40 is not really a
lubricant, hard as it is to believe. It's a solvent, and the lubricating
properties are *very* short-lived. What's worse, it's a migrating solvent, and
will spread to all the inside surfaces of your mice. After a while, they will
be super clean and super dry.

A lithium-based electronic-component grease is a much better choice. Radio
Slack should have it. (Sorry, I actually *like* Radio Slack, but many of its
stores are run by folks who know nothing about what they sell.)

Al

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 115       Sun Jan 02, 1994
A.HAJNAL [Axel]              at 14:57 EST

Greetings everyone!

   Does anyone out there know how to use the two 15-pin connectors on the left
side of the STE?   The pin diagram that came with my machine is really
confusing.   Can anyone give a better explanation of what each pin does?
Apparently one can connect a lightpen... this would seem to be a relatively
easy project(juct connect a photocell with a lens to the input pins...
right???).   Also the 'analog' joystick inputs, are they truely analog  (i.e.
the input voltage varies, and the STE takes care of the rest.), or do they
read a coded signal like the mouse port (again, I'm not sure if  I have my
facts straight.)   I hope you all can understand my questions.
   Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks!

   -Axel   A.HAJNAL
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 116       Sun Jan 02, 1994
A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt]       at 16:24 EST

Paul,


showmem3.prg from the codeheads works at all CPU speeds. There are many
others, but that's probably the best.

Al

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 117       Sun Jan 02, 1994
J.HURLEY1 [Jim Hurley]       at 20:08 EST

Mike - I did clean the pad as well, I do this routinely.

Al - Thanks for the tip about WD-40. I do have some lithium grease, I should
be able to apply it with a pointed applicator where it's needed. I like Radio
Shack, too. I miss the days when Allied and Lafayette were around as
competitors. But here in Silicon Valley, parts are very easy to find.

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 118       Sun Jan 02, 1994
K.SPRINGER1 [FROZEN NORTH]   at 20:43 EST

Jim Hurley,

Allied? Lafayette?  Let us not forget Heathkit.

WD-40 also does not like heat.  But it is non-conductive, and many 4-wheelers
spray the insides of their distributor caps when they go bounding though the
wet spray, as it also will displace water!

I've heard of people using it to rejuvenate printer ribbons also.

Ken S.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 119       Sun Jan 02, 1994
K.ESTES [Kenne@SFRT]         at 23:00 EST

 "WD 40" Water Displacement 40.

Who'da thought?
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 120       Mon Jan 03, 1994
R.BENNETT7 [Rodney]          at 01:47 EST

[Jim Hurley],

Any type of oil lubricant is not a good idea to use on the mouse. Although it
may work for a short time, it will require additional cleaning more
frequently.

My suggestion is to use grafite or something simular for lubrication if
anything at all.  You can clean the rollers and ball with rubbing alchol with
a cotton ball.  Or better yet, if you can afford it, buy an optical mouse (non-
mechanical)  :-)

Rodney

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 121       Mon Jan 03, 1994
J.MEEHAN3 [>> Joe M << ]     at 05:36 EST

        Since my father was a locksmith I can say with some authority
 that WD40 does have some heaver hydrocarbons that "stick" around.  If
 you use the stuff, or anything with a oil based lubricant don't be
 surprised if you start collecting more dust and dirt.

         I like WD40 for some uses and might use it in a mouse, using
 a cleaner afterwards.

         I have seen a lot of locks that people have lubricated using
 the stuff.  It is not a pretty sight. <grin>   Each time they add
 some more it leaves more sticky stuff in the lock till it can't be
 turned at all.  With a mouse if you don't clean it carefully the
 mouse will attract dust like a magnet.  I like the graphic idea for a
 lubricant.  It will not attract dirt and you have some right there on
 the end of your pencil when you need it, just grind it to a power.
 Don't use the stuff that has graphite in it, they also have oils in
 them.

 >> Joe M <<

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 122       Mon Jan 03, 1994
A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt]       at 08:43 EST

Ken,

And WD-40 is the worst possible thing for printer ribbons, too. Gunk city!

Al

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 123       Mon Jan 03, 1994
M.EASTER [Mike]              at 10:42 EST

Re WD-40 strengths and weaknesses

Chapters could be written on the subject.

An item: a professional typewriter cleaning and rehabilitation expert told me
to _never_ use WD-40 for maintenance of the typewriter's moving parts; that it
was the worst choice possible.  Periodic cleaning and a simple 3-in-1 type oil
was one example of a much superior choice.

Mike Easter
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 124       Mon Jan 03, 1994
ICDINC                       at 11:10 EST

In defense of WD-40 it works great on bicycle chains.  I spray mine down
before every other ride.  It removes all the road grime and leaves enough lub.
(lube)

Graphite or Silicone based lubes should be used on a mouse. (Or just buy a new
mouse when it stops working since the cord is usually bad by then.)

            - TOM -
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 125       Mon Jan 03, 1994
J.BRENNER1 [See Flat]        at 22:09 EST

So much mouse problems, I've only cleaned my mouse about once every six months
with a cue tip and alcohol. I've recently changed mouse. (just a personal
choice, My 6 year old Atari mouse is in perfect shape). I bought one that I
find fits my hand nicer and is also equiped with micro switches so a lot
lighter touch.

John B.

P.S. I use a state of the art :-) mouse pad that keeps dust away from
     the mouse.

Tom,
     I have been explicitly cautioned by the bicycle repair man to
 _never_ use the stuff on my chain. He said it would dry it out and
 prematuraly wear it. I think greese is the lubricant of choice for
 bicycle chains.

 Good thing this is General Q & A .....

 Anyone know how to make aple sauce.

John B.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 126       Mon Jan 03, 1994
K.ESTES [Kenne@SFRT]         at 22:13 EST

I use a lemon scented cleaner on my bike chain and lube it with a light
(reddish) oil.  WD 40 is nice in a pinch but it attracts too much dirt.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 127       Tue Jan 04, 1994
R.COOPER2 [Rob]              at 01:47 EST

See Flat (John):

 > ...I've only cleaned my mouse about once every six months with a
 >cue tip and alcohol.


        Hmmm.... I generally get together with friends with those two items...
at my local pool hall!  :^)

                                        Rob


 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 128       Tue Jan 04, 1994
J.HURLEY1 [Jim Hurley]       at 02:42 EST

FROZEN NORTH - Ahh, Heathkit... what a shame. I have a whole lab of Heathkit
gear: my scope, spectrum analyzer, RLC bridge, frequency counter,
semiconductor curve tracer, geez the list goes on...

Others - I never thought I'd be starting a thread on the sublime uses of
hydrocarbons! However, I have quite a supply of different lubricants and
cleaners, maybe a little TWEEK! will make the mouse work more sweetly;-) So
far, this mouse is working smoothly and flawlessly. I haven't cleaned it in
weeks - that's at least a week longer than I did in the past.

Let's give it a rest for now, and in a few months or so I'll drop a line and
let you know how things fare...
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 129       Tue Jan 04, 1994
M.EASTER [Mike]              at 03:22 EST

Rob - re cue tip...alcohol...pool hall

Ha!
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 130       Tue Jan 04, 1994
R.COOPER2 [Rob]              at 04:56 EST

Mike:

  >Rob - re cue tip...alcohol...pool hall
  >
  >Ha!


   <grin>  I just couldn't resist, Mike... y'know?   ;^)


                                                Rob

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 131       Tue Jan 04, 1994
A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt]       at 08:35 EST

Tom,

As a longtime bike enthusiast, I will differ on the use of WD-40 on chains. It
actually dries them out. I wrote an article some years back on this after
doing a lot of use tests.

Flat,

Aple sauce is hard to make. Use apples, it works better. :)

Al

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 132       Tue Jan 04, 1994
ICDINC                       at 16:21 EST

As a bike racer (time trials) and not a writer I will stick by WD-40. I have
tried Teflons, several of the "Bike Lubes", chain grease (waxy stuff), light
oils, and others. I spray my chain and scrub it with a toothbrush after every
other ride (about 70-100 miles). The WD-40 removes the grime, keeps the dirt
from clinging, and makes my derailer shift perfectly. I use it as a
solvent/lubricant.  So far I have about 3,000 miles on my latest Shimano D-A
HG chain.  IT still shifts like a dream.

      - TOM -

(Derailing)
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 133       Tue Jan 04, 1994
ICDINC                       at 16:27 EST

I forgot to mention that I was a bicycle mechanic in the late 60s and early
70s and then a motorcycle mechanic for a couple of years in the mid 70s. We
used a slightly heavier oil on those chains though.

        - TOM -
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 134       Tue Jan 04, 1994
J.BRENNER1 [See Flat]        at 18:12 EST

I've never tried playing pool with a cotton swab.  hehehe.

I think I should have said Qtip but that might be name brand at that, that no
one knows of. Oh well,....

HeathKit,
         my dad still has his HeathKit stereo receiver and amplifier
 in his living room. I think it's 7watts per channel, Interesting
 how our needs change. :-)

 I think the first distortion pedal for electric guitar I ever heard
 was a Heathkit. It was awfully distorted. ;-)

John B.


 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 135       Wed Jan 05, 1994
R.WATSON15 [Wayne Watson]    at 01:16 EST

   The mouse pad can make a big difference in how long you go before
 cleaning. With the type I use (smooth hard surface), I haven't
 cleaned my mouse in years. My mouse also has nylon rollers vs. metal
 rollers.

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 136       Wed Jan 05, 1994
A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt]       at 17:35 EST

Tom,

As a writer and not a bike racer, I'll stop trying to convince you. What
works, works. But it doesn't work for me. :)

Wayne,

I've got a MediaMate mouse pad that is contoured, has a non-fabric surface,
and is the EXACT color of my TT. What a find that was.

Al

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 137       Wed Jan 05, 1994
R.NELSON48 [Grouch (:{]      at 23:41 EST

>> Joe M <<

I feel like a walk on the off-topic side so following this WD-40 thread a
little further...

The locksmiths I know say it has an acid in it and using it on locks will
actually destroy the shims or pins or other dinkey little small parts.  I
don't know, that is just what I have been told.

I work part time as an armoror and I can tell you that the worst thing a
person can do to a hand gun or rifle is over lubricate it. Any amount of oil,
even very fine gun oil, will attract dust and lint.  Dust and lint in turn
attracts moisture and moisture in contact with steel, even stainless steel,
will cause rust.  Rust is not good for guns.  It makes the parts gritty and
ill-fitting and can result in a weapon that works better as a door stop than
as a means of self-defense.

The best way to lubricate steel is to apply oil sparingly with a clean patch
then wipe away all traces of the lubricant so that the metal appears dry.  The
steel is porous enough to hold plenty of lubricant you can't see and a "dry"
weapon will function much better than one that is all gunked up from over
oiling.

-=> back on topic:  What applies to modern weapons should apply as well to
modern mice.  Don't leave any trace of lubricant, don't even mess with WD-40
or other silicon spray products.  <=-

                                                         (:{ Grouch.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 138       Wed Jan 05, 1994
DAEDWARDS [Warrl]            at 23:57 EST

I can easily imagine that WD-40 (or some other "lubricant") will work fine for
a racer or other demander of high performance who would be lubricating a bike
chain (or any other mechanism) every three days with ANY lubricant... but
would be less than satisfactory for someone who wants to do the job once every
few months.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 139       Thu Jan 06, 1994
R.BENNETT7 [Rodney]          at 01:09 EST

[Joe M],

Graphite would be more useable than WD40 on something like the mouse, and I it
does not contain any 'oil' lubricients as WD40 does, so it does not 'gunk' up
or collect dust or dirt as with WD40.

Rodney

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 140       Thu Jan 06, 1994
K.SPRINGER1 [FROZEN NORTH]   at 22:25 EST

Actually, better than graphite is molybdenum disulfide.  It looks like
graphite but performs better.  At better motorcyle shops everywhere you should
be able to find a product called Dri-Slide.  It is moly di in a highly
volatile (meaning evaporates readily and is flammable) solvent for use on
throttle and brake cable, and can be found with a long hollow needle included
for getting it to tight places.

This stuff will get on, in, and through darn near anything, so don't spill it!

Ken S.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 141       Sat Jan 08, 1994
R.SNYDER6 [Roger S.]         at 16:40 EST

     Does anyone have a suggestion for connecting STs that are in different
houses about 100 feet away? The use would be mostly for file transfers. The
network would get light use in general. At times the use would be enough that
I would not like to tie up the phone lines with the connection, though this is
the way I expect I will go.

--Roger
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 142       Sat Jan 08, 1994
DAEDWARDS [Warrl]            at 19:28 EST

Roger S:

What I would think about trying (wouldn't actually try it without talking it
over with at least one other person who -- I think -- knows at least as much
about it as I do) would be to string your own private telephone line between
the two computers' modems.  There are a couple ways to go from there.  I would
put one computer into a loop, sending ATA to the modem until the modem replies
"CONNECT", then have the other computer send ATO to its modem.  Or maybe I'd
experiment with the "leased line" mode on my modem; I don't know what that
does.

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 143       Sat Jan 08, 1994
B.KANTOR [Bruce]             at 23:27 EST

Anybody who is lubricating their bicycle chain once every few months is doing
enough damage by riding with a dry chain that the tye of lubricant is
irrelivent.  Bike chains should be lubed every 200-300 miles.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 144       Sun Jan 09, 1994
R.SNYDER6 [Roger S.]         at 01:23 EST

Warrl,

     Thanks. I have hidden deep somewhere a "slightly funtioning" telephone
test box. It might be able to be fix enought to help me set up my own phone
line between buildings. There are short haul modems, and RS232 extenders
availble, but they are more than I care to spend.

--Roger
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 145       Sun Jan 09, 1994
K.ESTES [Kenne@SFRT]         at 02:55 EST

And bike manuals say chains should be replaced every 600 miles.  With mountain
bikes I'd believe that in a second,
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 146       Sun Jan 09, 1994
R.WATSON15 [Wayne Watson]    at 06:59 EST

 Roger,
   A null modem line to both computers would be the cheapest and
 easiest way to do it. Telephone wire is cheap. The best you will get
 however is 19200 (unless you have a MSTE/TT/Falcon).

   A network setup would also work pretty well. With a network setup,
 you could also not only transfer files, you could also operate the
 other computer remotely. This includes transfer files, run programs
 (which showup on your end), etc. I am not sure of the specifics of the
 networks available such as max length of wire, transfer speeds, etc.

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 147       Sun Jan 09, 1994
A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt]       at 13:35 EST

Roger,

Download the LittleNet archive here in the libraries (make sure you get the
one with "Secrets of LittleNet" in it) and it will do what you want. It's a
networking accessory that connects STs (and TTs and Falcii) via MIDI cables.
You can get very long MIDI cables at music dealers (Toad Music, for one).

Warrl,

LittleNet is a heck of a lot cheaper than stringing up a dedicated phone line.
And it's a true networking app.

Al

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 148       Sun Jan 09, 1994
DAEDWARDS [Warrl]            at 16:14 EST

Bruce:

Most people I know who have bicycles, probably ride 200-300 miles a year.  So
a lube once every few months is far higher than your indicated frequency.  :-)
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 149       Mon Jan 10, 1994
R.SNYDER6 [Roger S.]         at 02:51 EST

     Thanks Wayne and AL. Networking is they way I would prefer to go, but I
am concerened about costs because of the distance. I don't remember the MIDI
spec off hand (I have it as a text file some where--I need to organize my
hundreds of little text files), but the MIDI cables in the two catalogs here
only go up to 25 feet. I'll check out the LittleNet file.

--Roger

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 150       Mon Jan 10, 1994
A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt]       at 03:24 EST

Wayne,

LittleNet, LittleNet, LittleNet.

Why this wonderful little freebie is not better known is a mystery.

:)

Al

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 151       Mon Jan 10, 1994
S.DEITZ [Steve]              at 04:52 EST

 Al,

   RE: LittleNet

  We can all be a little thick <GRIN>.

                            ----STEVE----
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 152       Mon Jan 10, 1994
A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt]       at 11:18 EST

Roger,

A handy way of organizing a lot of littel texts (and keeping them from taking
up much space at all) is to ZIP them using ST Zip 2.4 (available here). ZIP
lets you read them frfom within a ZIP archive, without unzipping, and you can
even mark off part of a text to save it to the clipboard, or print part or all
of it, and so on. Given the nature of cluster sizes on disks, archiving a lot
of short texts into one ZIP file probably reduces the storage requirement by
95 percent or more. (Yep! It's true.) And if ST Zip is an installed app that
runs when you click on a ZIP file, you can just put your zipped text archive
onto the desktop as an icon, and click on it any time you want to read a text
or add to the archive.

Neat, yes? Ah, the power of the Atari.

Al

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 153       Mon Jan 10, 1994
J.BRENNER1 [See Flat]        at 18:14 EST

Roger,
      I've run Midi cables over 100 feet. A midi connector (5pin did)
 actually only has three of it's pins being used. All you need is
 two conductors and a shield. Make sure the wire is of good quality
 (low capacity) and you should have no problems.

 John B.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 154       Mon Jan 10, 1994
ST.LOU [Lou Rocha]           at 20:02 EST

Wayne, a recent problem has caused me to investigate LittleNet and I am VERY
impressed. All I need is 2 midi cables and a shareware payment. Of course,
none of this would make sense if not for Al Fasoldt's Secrets of Littlenet
included in the archive.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 155       Mon Jan 10, 1994
K.ESTES [Kenne@SFRT]         at 20:21 EST

When I built a midi patchpay at a recording studio I used Belden 8251. The
connector is a DIN 180 degree 5 pin.  They're a pain to work with.

You _might_ have problems with a 100 ft run. MIDI spec says that it's current
operated and you _may_ have too much of a current loss to operate the
optoisolaters if there's too much resistance.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 156       Mon Jan 10, 1994
ICDINC                       at 23:25 EST

Ken,

180 degree DIN 5s a "pain" to work with?

YOu haven't played much with the DIN 13s used on Atari monitors have you? :-(

 - TOM -
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 157       Mon Jan 10, 1994
K.ESTES [Kenne@SFRT]         at 23:39 EST

I'm not into pain.  I decided I'd buy my own MIDI cables.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 158       Tue Jan 11, 1994
A.HAJNAL [Axel]              at 00:28 EST

Hello everyone,

 About my earlier mess age about the ports on the STE... I guess that  no-one
could figure out what I was talking about, so I'll try again.

   I was wondering if anyone could explain how to connect an external device
like an analog joystick or a light pen to the ports on the left side of the
STE (below the keyboard).   I am particularly interested in the lightpen and
the analog inputs.    If anyone knows anything about these ports, I'd
appreciate the assitance.  If not, I might try experimenting on my own, and
then post my results here.   Anyway, thanks in advance to anyone who can help.

   -Axel   A.HAJNAL
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 159       Tue Jan 11, 1994
J.BRENNER1 [See Flat]        at 00:56 EST

Lou,
    I don't recall seing a shareware payment for Littlenet?

Kenne,
      I have run certain midi information over 100ft. When Midi
 first came out everyone said it was too slow even to do music. :-)
 I don't  know if I would risk transmitting data that I want to save
 over these distances but I suppose if tested often enough without
 any data getting corrupted it could be trusted.

 John B.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 160       Tue Jan 11, 1994
K.ESTES [Kenne@SFRT]         at 02:23 EST

The important thing is that MIDI is _current_ operated. Or at least Spec. 1.0
was current driven.

I remember the Midi debate. The Midi delay was 3ms throug the Thru port.
Multiple modules chained through tht THRU ports had a perceptable lag
(according to some--I never heard it).  The first US Midi synth was the
Prophet 600 (circa 1982). I think the Roland JX3P was the first commercial
Midi synth.  I suddenly feel old. I'm off to take some Geritol.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 161       Tue Jan 11, 1994
ICDINC                       at 08:55 EST

Axel,

I think the pinouts are in the STE manual.  If you don't have them, I will
send you a list.

 - TOM -
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 162       Tue Jan 11, 1994
ST.LOU [Lou Rocha]           at 19:35 EST

John, I stand corrected. Littlenet is listed as freeware.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 163       Tue Jan 11, 1994
A.HAJNAL [Axel]              at 20:08 EST

Tom-

   I've got the pins diagram from the STE manual, but the abbreviations make
little sense.   Also, there is no specification of what type of input each pin
accepts.  If you or anyone else here knows what the pin labels mean, I'd
appreciate some help.   Thanks!
   -Axel A.HAJNAL

   P.S. I hope my posts aren't too confusing ;)
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 164       Tue Jan 11, 1994
R.WATSON15 [Wayne Watson]    at 21:19 EST

   The thing you want to do when going this distance is get some GOOD
 Midi cables that are of Low Loss type. You should be able to get some
 wire that is of this type and build your own if you cannot find this
 type of premade cable at the length you need.

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 165       Wed Jan 12, 1994
B.SEMAAN [BOSEM]             at 03:04 EST

Axel,

The ST Compendium has the info you are looking for in Chapter 5. I don't have
the stamina to type that much stuff, but I can tell you that it gives read and
write register address for each pin along with methods to access joysticks,
paddles, and light pens/guns.

There is a lot of other stuff contained therein that you would have to
register as a developer to easily obtain otherwise.

As to the pin labels, they seem pretty understandable as to function. You have
the even # controllers on Port A (0,2) and the odd #'s on Port B (1,3).  Each
port has 1 ground and 1 power lead (VCC).  Each controller has an UP, DOWN,
LEFT, RIGHT, PADDLE cntrl, FIRE button. Controller 0 on Port A's FIRE button
also doubles as a trigger for light guns/pens.  The rest is in the Compendium,
list price $49.95. I bought mine from D & P Computers, but any Atari dealer
should have it.

                                    Bob

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 166       Wed Jan 12, 1994
O-ZONE [Flakes]              at 19:09 EST

  Another option would be to get adapters from MIDI to balanced line
microphone cable for long runs. Helps prevent signal loss.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 167       Fri Jan 14, 1994
A.HAJNAL [Axel]              at 04:01 EST

Bob-

  Thanks for the info.  I should be able to figure it out now.  I just that
before I wasn't sure what the labels meant.   I think now I'll try
experimenting a bit.   Not being quite sure of which lead was which, I was
afraid to experiment lest I fry a chip.   Anyway, thanks for the help.

   -Axel   A.HAJNAL
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 168       Fri Jan 14, 1994
R.SNYDER6 [Roger S.]         at 05:33 EST

     I've made most of my MIDI cables. I'll try long ones, (and if it is too
far I can always make some more little ones). I do think my 100+ feet run is
pushing it, but it is work a try.

     I like the idea of Zipping all the little text files and plopping them on
the desktop. Of course I have to _do_ it. Many of the files are ones I haven't
even read but are just there "untill I get around to it."

Thanks all-Roger


 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 169       Fri Jan 14, 1994
K.ESTES [Kenne@SFRT]         at 20:58 EST

If you're a little technical you can make a little MIDI thr box amplifier to
extend the distance. Heck, you can probably buy one for cheap.

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 170       Sat Jan 15, 1994
R.SNYDER6 [Roger S.]         at 18:02 EST

     I suppose I could put my MIDI patch bay halfway between the buildings :).

     I seem to recall I have plans for as MIDI thru box amp somewhere. It is
designed to do more than that, but I could just drop the extra circuitry.
Since I dug up the MIDI specs, it wouldn't even be hard to desgin one.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 171       Sat Jan 15, 1994
K.ESTES [Kenne@SFRT]         at 23:16 EST

Cable length may not be a problem. I vaguely remember that the thru portion of
MIDI was basically a driver amp and an Opto-isolater.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 172       Sun Jan 16, 1994
BRIAN.H [ST~SysOp]           at 21:24 EST

OK, I finally bought a mono monitor and has it connected to a colour or color
monitor via monitor master. However, I have notice a mark decrease in the
finest of the ptich on my SC 1435. Why is monitor master doing this?

~~Brian..Written on Sunday 16 January 1994 at 10:18 p.m. ADT

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 173       Sun Jan 16, 1994
DAEDWARDS [Warrl]            at 21:54 EST

Brian, if you have a mono and color monitor side by side, both turned on, they
WILL interfere with each other.

The primary cause of this is that the vertical scan is 60 Hz on the color, and
70 Hz on the mono.  The magnetic fields simply cannot get into sync.  Most
often, the symptoms are more visible on the color monitor.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 174       Sun Jan 16, 1994
BRIAN.H [ST~SysOp]           at 22:28 EST

Nope, my monitor master didn't come with directions so I turn one monitor off
before hitting the button. However, thanks for the reminder just in case.
Basically what is happening is the colour monitor don't look as sharp as
before.

Brian..Written on Sunday 16 January 1994 at 11:26 p.m. ADT
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 175       Mon Jan 17, 1994
ICDINC [Tom]                 at 00:01 EST

You probably lost the shielding around the RGB lines through the monitor
master.  That will degrade the picture.

 - TOM -
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 176       Mon Jan 17, 1994
A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt]       at 18:15 EST

Brian,

What Warrl said is a good point. But I haven't seen the color display here
look any different when put thru the Monitor Master. Hmm, a mystery.

Al

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 177       Mon Jan 17, 1994
J.BRENNER1 [See Flat]        at 18:46 EST

Brian,
      There was no difference using Monitor Master or not with my 1224.

John B.

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 178       Mon Jan 17, 1994
ST.LOU [Lou Rocha]           at 19:42 EST

Brian, I have used a monitor master for years and have one hooked up to my
SM124 and Commodore 1702. The switch is to the side of the monitors which are
8 inches apart... no intereference of any kind with both of them on.

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 179       Wed Jan 19, 1994
DARLAH [RT~SYSOP]            at 13:14 EST

I also use monitor master. I have used it for eons with no problems.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 180       Fri Jan 21, 1994
R.MORROW10 [Bob M.]          at 00:46 EST

Does anyone know what the 8 DIP switches on the lower RH corner of the MSTe
motherboard control?  One (#7) is to open up high-density formatting abilities
in TOS 2.06, but what about the others?
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 181       Fri Jan 21, 1994
ATARI.BENLUX [W. Kilwinger]  at 03:07 EST

R.MORROW10 [Bob M.]:
 >
 >Does anyone know what the 8 DIP switches on the lower RH corner of the MSTe
 >motherboard control?  One (#7) is to open up high-density formatting
abilities
 >in TOS 2.06, but what about the others?

One is to disable/enable stereo sound, most of them are unsused and I forgot
the others. All factory settings, not very usefull to play with except the
documented switch 7 (if you have the right hardware).

Regards,

Wilfred



 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 182       Sun Feb 06, 1994
J.HURLEY1 [Jim Hurley]       at 05:17 EST

A little while back I posted a message about my mouse problems: I had three
mice and they all got gunked after a very short time. Then I posted about how
I solved the problem by spraying WD-40 on the axes and doing a good cleaning.
This led to a wild extravaganza into exotic lubricants and a warning NOT to
use WD-40.

Anyway, in the last month or so I have not had a single mouse problem. I had
NEVER gone this long before without a thorough cleaning.

So, in short, so far the usage of WD-40 has been a blessing for me.

I have (and always had) a mouse pad that I kept clean, no other changes were
made except for the spray of the axes joints.

As they say, YOUR mileage may vary.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 183       Sun Feb 06, 1994
A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt]       at 12:39 EST

Jim,

What works, works. Keep us informed of the progress. My suspicion is that the
fix may not be a long-lived one; that's what I have found when using WD-40 in
the past for similar uses.

Al

 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 184       Sun Feb 06, 1994
G.FUQUAY [GGF]               at 12:48 EST

Jim,

I read your original message, and all the replys to it with interest, but I
didn't reply. I don't know why, but I didn't. But now I think you should know
about my mouse problems, which amount to zero!

I bought my firs 520ST in 1985, and I still have the original mouse. It has
never been taken apart or cleaned in any way. I still have it, but retired it
when I bought the Mega STe about a year ago. I have not had any problems with
that one either. I am still using the original mouse pad that I bought for the
520, and it has never been cleaned either.

Regards, Gary
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 185       Sun Feb 06, 1994
J.BRENNER1 [See Flat]        at 15:42 EST

 I also have an original mouse that dates from 87. I only stopped using
 it when I purchased one with microswitches that were less resistant to
 my fingers, :-)
 I think how dirty the mouse gets depends on a few factors.

 1.The mouse pad, if it's a smooth hard surface less dirt will
 gather on it, therefore less dirt comes in contact with the track
 ball.
 2.Obviously how much use the mouse gets. If one uses his computer to
   type letters all day long the mouse won't see much dirt.
 3.A good mouse accelerator. If you keep running out of mouse pad space
   and have to lift the mouse and reset it on the pad, you are scooping
   up dirt constantly.
 4.If the mouse is used to play arcade games, the mouse gets extensive
   lift and reset action stated above AND real beating.

 None of these opinions were based on a controled scientific
 experimentation. :-)

 John B.
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 186       Mon Feb 07, 1994
J.MEEHAN3 [>> Joe M << ]     at 04:57 EST

HINT:

        Clean you mouse pad from time to time using a piece of tape; the
sticky side will pick up most crud and leave your pad clean and dry.

>> Joe M <<
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 187       Mon Feb 07, 1994
ARCHIVIST [Charlie]          at 19:49 EST

John, that's a good list but there's one thing I can think to add: how you
hold the mouse. I always hold the mouse with my finger tips, resting my forarm
on the arm of my chair. My father, OTOH, always moves the mouse to the top of
the desk and rests his forarm on the desk. The result is, I think, that oils
from his skin are spread on the desk and get picked up by the rollers when the
mouse moves through them.

I'm not sure if this is a common problem but I know I only clean my mouse once
every six months or so while father has to clean his at least once a week.
Trust me when I say I've tried to break him of this habit. Oh, and neither of
us use a mousepad, just the bare desk/sliding drawer.

Charlie/sysop
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 188       Tue Feb 08, 1994
J.BRENNER1 [See Flat]        at 00:40 EST

TAPE HINT:
          use masking tape. :-)
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 189       Tue Feb 08, 1994
B.SEMAAN [BOSEM]             at 01:26 EST

Since someone brought up WD-40 again, it reminded me that it was mentioned
here that WD-40 could be used to revitalize printer ribbons.  Then someone
else said WD-40 would gunk up the printhead. Well, I've got several never-used
ribbons that got dried out and don't work worth a flip.  I can't return them,
but is there something that is safe that I could use to 'recondition' them so
I can get some use out of them.

Bob
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 190       Tue Feb 08, 1994
K.ESTES [Kenne@SFRT]         at 02:58 EST

How about a ribbon re-inker sold at some business supply stores AND/OR
computer shopper?
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 191       Tue Feb 08, 1994
M.EASTER [Mike]              at 03:38 EST

Charlie - re how you hold the mouse ..skin oils

Good point.  Not only oils; dead skin cells in tiny sheets, composed of waxy
keratin, real gunky stuff when compressed together.

Bob - re revitalize dried printer ribbons

Difficult challenge.  Depending on the methodology of the continuous ribbon,
dried ribbons are not only dry and stiff, but "crinkled", enabling them to
hangup on one spot, perforate; might even catch a pin.

There used to be a gizmo for re-inking ribbons that would also have the
advantage of spooling and "processing" the ribbon to soften and "de-crinkle"
it; ie maybe take out the ironed-in stiff wrinkles.

Mike Easter

reinker - lag
 ------------
Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 192       Tue Feb 08, 1994
J.HURLEY1 [Jim Hurley]       at 03:58 EST


 >ARCHIVIST [Charlie]
 >
 >John, that's a good list but there's one thing I can think to add: how you
 >hold the mouse. I always hold the mouse with my finger tips, resting my
forarm
 >on the arm of my chair. My father, OTOH, always moves the mouse to the top
of
 >the desk and rests his forarm on the desk. The result is, I think, that oils
 >from his skin are spread on the desk and get picked up by the rollers when
the
 >mouse moves through them.

This is what I do and I think that's my problem as I have rather oily skin.
But I do keep things clean and I don't play any computer games. In fact, I
rarely use the mouse while I'm on-line - my main usage of the Atari.

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Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 193       Tue Feb 08, 1994
A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt]       at 19:39 EST

Charlie,

I suspect you are right. I use a MediaMate non-porous mouse pad, which I can
just dunk in sudsy water now and then, and my beloved Best mouse has remained
clean for months and months.

The MediaMate is the precise color of my TT, too. :)

Bob,

If they are truly dried out, the answer is probably no. Otherwise, they
wouldn't be dried out. <g>

Al

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Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 194       Thu Feb 10, 1994
B.SEMAAN [BOSEM]             at 06:09 EST

Guys,

These ribbons are brand new, right out of a sealed polybag and box. When I
said they are dried out, I did not mean stiff, creased, brittle, etc.  They
are just as supple as any new ribbon.  But, the ink does not rub off on my
fingers when I rub the ribbon between them, and printout is very light.  I
have about 6 of these and thought someone may have had luck with using some
sort of solvent to get the ink that is already on the ribbon to 'flow' so to
speak.

I've seen the ads for 're-inkers' too.  But did not want to take a chance on
that without first hearing somebody's firsthand positive experience with one.

Bob

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Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 195       Thu Feb 10, 1994
A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt]       at 08:40 EST

Bob,

Ah, I see. All the cautions about WD-40 apply, though. Maybe a little Freon or
something.

Al

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Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 196       Thu Feb 10, 1994
T.YURICK [T.YURICK]          at 20:06 EST

Al...

>Maybe a little Freon or something.

Give the ozone layer a break, use something else. I think it's illegal to
release Freon into the atmosphere anyway. Maybe someone who really knows
something about ribbons will have a better  suggestion.

Regards, Tom

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Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 197       Thu Feb 10, 1994
A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt]       at 22:28 EST

Tom,

Sorry. My humor wasn't very obvious. :)

Al

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Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 198       Fri Feb 11, 1994
R.NELSON48 [Grouch (:{]      at 02:18 EST

BOSEM - I used WD-40 a few times on ribbons and it did loosen up the residual
ink.  Printout were blotchy however because application to the ribbon was not
uniform.  Months later while using new ribbons I lost the tail to my "y" and
other decenders when a pin froze up.  Was this related to the WD-40?  Don't
know, but don't use it any more either.

Best bet would be to contact the ribbon maker and find out what kind of ink
was used.  It is probably some kind of oil based solvent holding the ink that
has dried out.  If you knew what it was you could renew the ribbon.  Any
solvent that will cut oil should also work such as alcohol or ether (but I
wouldn't use ether, either.  Too much of a fire hazzard).

Good luck.  If you come up with something post it here and we will all learn
from your experience.                       (:{ Grouch.
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Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 199       Fri Feb 11, 1994
M.EASTER [Mike]              at 04:34 EST

Bob - re "old" new printer ribbons

I recently returned a recently purchased ribbon to the office supply store
from which it was purchased.  Although the ink was working, the ribbon was
"stiff" and the ribbon advancing mechanism of the printer wouldn't reel the
ribbon properly.  The fault was easily demonstrable to them with the ribbon
cartridge's auxiliary "winder" with the cartridge out of the printer.  The
effect was to allow the ribbon to get stuck in one spot in operation and the
pins to perforate the ribbon.

The store was glad to replace/exchange the ribbon for another brand of a
compatible ribbon cartridge, and the store owner was willing to spend a few
minutes with me discussing his experiences of how that could happen.

He said that the age of recently purchased ribbons was extremely variable.
Many manufacturers make ribbons and warehouse them for very long periods,
followed by office supply house jobbers warehousing, followed by office supply
stores warehousing.. you get the picture.  Because of such experiences, his
store/s were currently purchasing its ribbons directly from one manufacturer
(I forget the name right now) which makes a multitude of compatibles.  The
manufacturer was able to convince him that their manufacturing and order
processing methods enabled them to provide him with ribbons which were very
very fresh.

Anyway, the replacement ribbon cartridge he provided me was just fine, and the
auxiliary winder gizmo demonstrated its mechanism to move the ribbon more
easily and smoothly than any of the old ribbons I had lying around.  (I save
my old ribbon cartridges; there used to be a ribbon re-inking house I was
thinking of using, now there isn't one).  I don't use enough ribbons to
justify buying a re-inker and doing my own.

The point of my story is that you may have kept some ribbons around for a
while which were already very old when you got them.

Mike Easter
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Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 200       Fri Feb 11, 1994
R.WHITTAM [Ron - ABUG]       at 23:13 EST

 >        Clean you mouse pad from time to time using a piece of tape; the
 >sticky side will pick up most crud and leave your pad clean and dry.

This is true.  I have had a great deal of difficulty picking up anything until
I started using the sticky side.  <...g>

 Ron


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Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 201       Sat Feb 12, 1994
J.MEEHAN3 [>> Joe M << ]     at 09:03 EST

Ron,

        The sticky side instruction was just for you.  I'll bet you got the
green side up instructions when you lay sod also. <grin>

>> Joe M <<
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Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 202       Sat Feb 12, 1994
L.BURSTYN [L Burstyn]        at 09:26 EST

PROBLEM report.  HELP.

Warp 9 and X-Boot will not work together at all.  When I have both of them
loaded, X-Boot (Version 3.1), comes up all weird--colors not right, screen
jumbled (not completely erased or overlaid).  The end result is complete
LOCKOUT of the hard drive.  FORCING a reformating and restoring of programs,
partitions, etc.,

At least when I do not have them both installed I don't have to restore and
repartition the hard drive.  And since I am currently using the hard drive the
system does work when ONLY Warp 9 (Version 3.8) is installed.  The screen
saver does not seem to work with Warp 9 (unless I move the mouse to engage it
manually).

Currently using CPX program to update what ACC's and AUTO programs I want to
load and run -- necessiting rebooting.

The Hard Drive is currently being worked by version 6.1.4 of ICDBOOT. Version
6.4.3 does not seem to recognize my Floptical.

Equipment:  STE w/4 MEG, AdSpeed, TOS 2.06.  Quantom(sp) 105 HD in H&P
enclosure w/ICD mech, PLI (Insite) Floptical, modem and printer.
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Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 203       Sat Feb 12, 1994
MUSE [Tomas]                 at 15:01 EST

L Burstyn,
 I can't think of any way that X-Boot and Warp 9 could FORCE a reformat of
your hard drive.  Are you having the ICD Utilities pick the resolution you
boot up in?  Warp 9 may hang if that's the case. Select "Skip" from ICD's
Utilities.

 Extend-O-Save might not kick in for several reasons: a joystck, dongle or
MIDI equipment for instance.  Read the Warp 9 topic and its archives for
complete information.

 What "CPX" are you using "to update...ACC's and AUTO programs..."???

 ===Tomas===

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Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 204       Sat Feb 12, 1994
O-ZONE [Flakes]              at 16:30 EST

  I have been using Warp 9 and Xboot together on my STE for a long time with
no conflicts. Perhaps it has to do with Adspeed.
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Category 4,  Topic 10
Message 205       Sun Feb 13, 1994
J.MEEHAN3 [>> Joe M << ]     at 10:37 EST

Message 202       Sat Feb 12, 1994BURSTYN [L Burstyn]


        I am guessing you are ending up with a auto/accessory configuration on
your hard drive that are in conflict and will not allow you to boot.  It is
possible to use your ICD utilities to boot from a floppy and still recognize
the hard drive so you can manually de-activate the offending
program/accessory.

>> Joe M <<
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